# Termination



## EllenP

Have a nice life


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## Xanatos

If it’s actually a PIP, then it means very little. It takes a few PIP discussions before a corrective action, then a few more discussions before a final warning. 

Also, companies are allowed to fire nice people if they do something that could get them fired. I don’t think there is any way for us to give decent advice without knowing a hell of a lot more information.


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## MxTarget

STL are actually the easiest store team member to terminate, however, it’s pretty rare.


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## Captain Orca

No info.  Next post please.


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## EllenP

Do you need much more info? The "issues" are typical issues around department performance, etc. Several ETLs have been on leave during COVID over the last several weeks and he was not given support. Basically busted his A to keep the store together. THere has been NO known documentation of performacnce issues. No issues over compliance, no illegal behavior. It's really around department performance, which has been rocky during the pandemic.


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## Xanatos

EllenP said:


> Do you need much more info? The "issues" are typical issues around department performance, etc. Several ETLs have been on leave during COVID over the last several weeks and he was not given support. Basically busted his A to keep the store together. THere has been NO known documentation of performacnce issues. No issues over compliance, no illegal behavior. It's really around department performance, which has been rocky during the pandemic.


So your store is struggling and your DSD documented a minor discussion with your SD?


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## happygoth

STL? Do you mean Store Director? 

The buck stops with him when it comes to store performance. If he's been with the company that long, he may be set in his ways and struggling with how to implement new policies. Hate to say it, but sometimes being "super passionate" can be a negative. They have to hold their team accountable.


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## EllenP

Xanatos said:


> So your store is struggling and your DSD documented a minor discussion with your SD?


He was told he was going on a PIP on wednesday.


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## EllenP

happygoth said:


> STL? Do you mean Store Director?
> 
> The buck stops with him when it comes to store performance. If he's been with the company that long, he may be set in his ways and struggling with how to implement new policies. Hate to say it, but sometimes being "super passionate" can be a negative. They have to hold their team accountable.


Yes a SD. What I'm really asking is, can they really get rid of him that quickly? This just doesn't seem right. And in the middle of a pandemic where everyone is working at 200%.


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## allnew2

EllenP said:


> THere has been NO known documentation of performacnce issues. No issues over compliance, no illegal behavior. It's really around department performance, which has been rocky during the pandemic.


That you know of? Besides you just said it’s around department performance that alone means he is not doing his job and holding his/her Etl /Tl accountable. At the end of the day it’s his/her store and if it failing is because it starts from the top.


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## happygoth

Sometimes new District/Regional folks come and start cleaning house. Could be your store has been on Corporate's radar and they want action.


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## allnew2

EllenP said:


> Yes a SD. What I'm really asking is, can they really get rid of him that quickly? This just doesn't seem right. And in the middle of a pandemic where everyone is working at 200%.


Yea it can happened. I had my former SD that was with target for 34 years .  He was basically told either retire or you are fired .


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## happygoth

allnew2 said:


> Yea it can happened. I had my former SD that was with target for 34 years .  He was basically told either retire or you are fired .


That happened to a store manager at my old job too, when the company changed how they did things. If folks can't adapt, then it's out with the old, in with the new.


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## allnew2

happygoth said:


> That happened to a store manager at my old job too, when the company changed how they did things. If folks can't adapt, then it's out with the old, in with the new.


He was such a push back tho on everything . I remember when I transfer he told me to give him a call in a year when I don’t have a job . And I said how about you give me a call in a year when you lose your job.  And to be honest I felt bad I said that because not even  a year later he was gone and I was taken back by the dtl .


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## EllenP

happygoth said:


> Sometimes new District/Regional folks come and start cleaning house. Could be your store has been on Corporate's radar and they want action.


I'm thinking this is what it is. Does anyone have any idea around severance for someone with that tenure?


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## sunnydays

a pip is nothing, it's just a generic documented performance discussion


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## buliSBI

Target has always been known for performancing people out no more matter the level.  I have had Execs who were older and seasoned Target Execs who were performanced out and then replaced with younger, hipper, and cheaply salaried rookie Execs.


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## Hardlinesmaster

EllenP said:


> I'm thinking this is what it is. Does anyone have any idea around severance for someone with that tenure?


401k & pension.


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## Xanatos

EllenP said:


> He was told he was going on a PIP on wednesday.


A PIP is nothing, like another user said above.


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## EllenP

Xanatos said:


> A PIP is nothing, like another user said above.


his boss said that he has 30-45 days. That sounds like it is something to me.


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## Xanatos

EllenP said:


> his boss said that he has 30-45 days. That sounds like it is something to me.


Before getting fired or before moving to the next step? If it's before getting fired, then it's basically a final warning. If it's actually a PIP, then maybe the DSD is giving him 30-45 days to improve before they go to a corrective action or something.


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## EllenP

Xanatos said:


> Before getting fired or before moving to the next step? If it's before getting fired, then it's basically a final warning. If it's actually a PIP, then maybe the DSD is giving him 30-45 days to improve before they go to a corrective action or something.


He just said that the PIP is that if he doesn't improve within 30-45 days, he is axed. I guess it's a final warning but there wasn't even a first warning.


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## allnew2

I don’t understand your concern with all this. If he/she is not doing their job is time to bring someone who can .


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## EllenP

allnew2 said:


> I don’t understand your concern with all this. If he/she is not doing their job is time to bring someone who can .


Confused about why you think they aren't doing their job? They are excellent at what they do. Either way, your comment was not needed nor additive to this conversation.


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## sunnydays

EllenP said:


> He just said that the PIP is that if he doesn't improve within 30-45 days, he is axed. I guess it's a final warning but there wasn't even a first warning.


then it’s not a PIP

multiple PIPs = one CA
multiple CAs = term

something else is going on here :/


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## EllenP

Have a nice life


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## allnew2

EllenP said:


> Confused about why you think they aren't doing their job? They are excellent at what they do. Either way, your comment was not needed nor additive to this conversation.


I think you are the one confused . You said that it has been departments  performance therefor he/she is not doing their job. If your Sd was “excellent” at what they do they wouldn’t be talked too.
You seemed to be way to invested in this situation . And clearly not all the details are known to you .


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## allnew2

sunnydays said:


> then it’s not a PIP
> 
> multiple PIPs = one CA
> multiple CAs = term
> 
> something else is going on here :/


Not to worry the op said Sd is excellent at what he/she does . My point exactly


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## IWishIKnew

Does Target use PIP (Performance Improvement Plan) differently than everywhere else? Everywhere else a PIP is a plan to "get your shit together in the next x days or your fired", and it's usually a list of specific goals & milestones that need to be met or you're gone.


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## Amanda Cantwell

I feel like this "someone" is op. Just a hunch.


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## allnew2

Amanda Cantwell said:


> I feel like this "someone" is op. Just a hunch.


My thoughts as well


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## sunnydays

IWishIKnew said:


> Does Target use PIP (Performance Improvement Plan) differently than everywhere else? Everywhere else a PIP is a plan to "get your shit together in the next x days or your fired", and it's usually a list of specific goals & milestones that need to be met or you're gone.


yes unfortunately and it sucks lol


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## IWishIKnew

That's so weird. And dumb. The fact that you'd have a "performance improvement plan" as a meaningless thing before a corrective action is really nonsensical.


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## commiecorvus

IWishIKnew said:


> Does Target use PIP (Performance Improvement Plan) differently than everywhere else? Everywhere else a PIP is a plan to "get your shit together in the next x days or your fired", and it's usually a list of specific goals & milestones that need to be met or you're gone.



Yeah, their PIP is just the last step to Performancing you out the door.
It doesn't matter what you do or how well you perform, it's just part of the paperwork they are filling out to make sure you can't get them for firing you unjustly.
Because if their is anything Spot is good at, it's making sure their paperwork is in order.


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## Yetive

PIP is different at the executive level.  When we moved to Workday, coachings started to be under Performance Improvement Plan--Performance Conversations.  ETL and up don't really get coached. I'm not sure who OP is to the person in question.  It is a bit concerning that he has unloaded all of this on one of his employees.  And, of course we are getting only one side of the story.


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## EllenP

sunnydays said:


> then it’s not a PIP
> 
> multiple PIPs = one CA
> multiple CAs = term
> 
> something else is going on here :/


That's not the way it works in his district.


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## CleanMyBackRoOm

There's a lot that happens behind closed doors or on phone screens that TLs, ETLs, and TMs don't ever see or hear about.  If an SD is on their way out regardless of tenure their store must be really hurting.  In some form or another there has to be a reason a DSD is all of a sudden ratcheting up the pressure.  Things like this just don't happen out of the blue.  DSD's don't have an up and coming new toy leader they wanna give a test run to.  If they do have leaders in the pipe to become SD's they find them homes.  They can legit go to any district so something isn't adding up here.  I'm trying to stay constructive and open minded about the situation but something doesn't smell right.


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## sunnydays

EllenP said:


> That's not the way it works in his district.


process is the same, districts don't just get to magically change their terminology or how the process works on the hr side. something else is going on that you are not aware of or things aren't being correctly communicated to you


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## Ashfromoldsite

EllenP said:


> I know someone who has been with Target for over 20 years, has climbed the ladder and has been an STL for several years now. Always recognized as a hard worker and super passionate. He recently got a new boss who is now trying to push him out. No known performance issue documentation at all, but has now been told he's going on a PIP. This seems completely insane. How can Target do this? Do you think he has grounds to get legal involved?
> 
> Side note, he is unsure of severance policy if he is terminated. Can anyone answer that?


A store director ( not stl ) that has been with target for years, knows the severance policy. Which is nothing. Severance is for people laid off, job eliminated. Severance is not for people performanced out.


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## Ashfromoldsite

Amanda Cantwell said:


> I feel like this "someone" is op. Just a hunch.


I just don’t think a sd that has been with target for years, would even need to come here and ask. The whole scenario is fake.


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## REDcardJJ

yeah you kinda can't just be put on a performance improvement plan for no reason... so this has been a long time coming. a year at a minimum unless there's some conduct behavior going on here..... 🤔


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## StyleStar

EllenP said:


> I know someone who has been with Target for over 20 years, has climbed the ladder and has been an STL for several years now. Always recognized as a hard worker and super passionate. He recently got a new boss who is now trying to push him out. No known performance issue documentation at all, but has now been told he's going on a PIP. This seems completely insane. How can Target do this? Do you think he has grounds to get legal involved?
> 
> Side note, he is unsure of severance policy if he is terminated. Can anyone answer that?


Why the hell would your SD share that info with you/team. If he had been with Target 20+ years he knows a pdd is a slap on the wrist, and its quite comical he wants to get legal involved over a pdd for a bad visit.


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## Tessa120

You know far too much about the inner workings of what's going on. So...did the SD sire you? Or is he inking his pen in your inkwell?


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## EllenP

Yall are funny. Reading all this is cracking me up. And really showing that most of yall really have no idea what actually goes on at Target behind closed doors. Also pretty naive to think I work for this person,  or that this person leads my team. I do not work for Target (thank God). Since I posted this I've found out about a lot of what happens to people at Target when they are being pushed out. I'll just say that most of you are incorrect in what you think you know. Hopefully you don't have to find out, but something tells me that you will...Thanks for no help - assholes.


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## Amanda Cantwell

EllenP said:


> Yall are funny. Reading all this is cracking me up. And really showing that most of yall really have no idea what actually goes on at Target behind closed doors. Also pretty naive to think I work for this person,  or that this person leads my team. I do not work for Target (thank God). Since I posted this I've found out about a lot of what happens to people at Target when they are being pushed out. I'll just say that most of you are incorrect in what you think you know. Hopefully you don't have to find out, but something tells me that you will...Thanks for no help - assholes.


So you’re not a target employee, and you’re telling target employees we don’t know what goes on at Target?

I truly don’t have words


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## sunnydays

EllenP said:


> Yall are funny. Reading all this is cracking me up. And really showing that most of yall really have no idea what actually goes on at Target behind closed doors. Also pretty naive to think I work for this person,  or that this person leads my team. I do not work for Target (thank God). Since I posted this I've found out about a lot of what happens to people at Target when they are being pushed out. I'll just say that most of you are incorrect in what you think you know. Hopefully you don't have to find out, but something tells me that you will...Thanks for no help - assholes.


why the hell did you even post here then lmfao


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## Xanatos

EllenP said:


> Yall are funny. Reading all this is cracking me up. And really showing that most of yall really have no idea what actually goes on at Target behind closed doors. Also pretty naive to think I work for this person,  or that this person leads my team. I do not work for Target (thank God). Since I posted this I've found out about a lot of what happens to people at Target when they are being pushed out. I'll just say that most of you are incorrect in what you think you know. Hopefully you don't have to find out, but something tells me that you will...Thanks for no help - assholes.


You’re welcome!


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## EllenP

Amanda Cantwell said:


> So you’re not a target employee, and you’re telling target employees we don’t know what goes on at Target?
> 
> I truly don’t have words


Move on with your life sweetie.


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## EllenP

Ashfromoldsite said:


> I just don’t think a sd that has been with target for years, would even need to come here and ask. The whole scenario is fake.


Soooo fake


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## Ashfromoldsite

Prob doesn’t work at target cause she was fired. Lmao


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## Captain Orca

EP    Get some skim (healthy) get some Ovaltine (healthy sort of)  open up a box of Great Value Ginger Snaps (certainly healthy)  and PARTY!


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## EllenP

Have a nice life


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## Tessa120

That SD really needs to think about his choice of inkwells.  Picking the crazy ink never works in the long run.

@Captain Orca Great Value?  Really??  This board?  And Ensure is a million times better than Ovaltine, Ensure tastes like a super silky Nesquik.


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## Captain Orca

Yup, some of Wally's brands are pretty good.  Their caffeine free diet cola beats "Coke" any day.


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## Tessa120

Nothing beats Coke.  Pepsi, yes, store brands can beat that.  Dr. Pepper, harder, but I've tasted decent store brands.  But Coke, there's nothing comparable.


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## Amanda Cantwell

Some call me crazy... but there is a difference between Sierra Mist and sprite, and sprite is better.


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## Target81

CleanMyBackRoOm said:


> There's a lot that happens behind closed doors or on phone screens that TLs, ETLs, and TMs don't ever see or hear about.  If an SD is on their way out regardless of tenure their store must be really hurting.  In some form or another there has to be a reason a DSD is all of a sudden ratcheting up the pressure.  Things like this just don't happen out of the blue.  DSD's don't have an up and coming new toy leader they wanna give a test run to.  If they do have leaders in the pipe to become SD's they find them homes.  They can legit go to any district so something isn't adding up here.  I'm trying to stay constructive and open minded about the situation but something doesn't smell right.


I think I figured out the confusing, not adding up formula...I believe it's E.P. + The D= SD < Crazy.


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## Tessa120

Amanda Cantwell said:


> Some call me crazy... but there is a difference between Sierra Mist and sprite, and sprite is better.



7-Up is best. Interesting history behind 7-Up too, a less scandalous version of Coke.



Target81 said:


> I think I figured out the confusing, not adding up formula...I believe it's E.P. + The D= SD < Crazy.



I've been saying it all along. Ink wells.


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## Captain Orca

Approx 10 tsp of refined white sugar in a real Coke.  Not happening here.  Drop the white sugar, go with just sugar.  Corporations like that better.


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