# Fulfillment being phased out?



## ahhd4mn (Jan 10, 2021)

sjowdb w


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## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 10, 2021)

No. Same pay.


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## Jayunderscore (Jan 10, 2021)

This is now the second time I've heard this and if it's true, it'll be a nightmare.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 10, 2021)

No hours in January


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## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 10, 2021)

Spot maybe doing the instocks thing on the flex teams.


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## vngoghlvr (Jan 10, 2021)

I could see that working for stores with OPU only, but not with ship.  Although nothing would surprise me anymore, they will cross train everybody and either bitch that fulfillment isn't done on time or whatever else they should be working on isn't.  Our mid shift GM peeps spend most time on a lane or in opu.  Then we hear about reshops, zone, rollover, OFOs.  Well you can't have it both ways, people can only wear so many hats.  And if you want something done fast and efficiently, you should have the training and payroll to back it up.  Neither of which Spot excells at anymore.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 10, 2021)

@seasonaldude. Any info?


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## BurgerBob (Jan 10, 2021)

Yup you can't add 3 jobs onto someone and expect them to be in 3 places at once


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## Anelmi (Jan 10, 2021)

^^ And those of us at GS say "hold my beer."


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## BurgerBob (Jan 10, 2021)

Yup that's me at tech.


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## vyrt (Jan 10, 2021)

Yeah. Let me tell you about getting tossed multiple hats and being told to worn each one fully all the time. 

That being said I doubt that fulfillment will go away in the busier stores. My store started off slow. Exploded last year and is already pulling more resources than we have hours for so the rest of the metrics are starting to fall behind already.


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## MrT (Jan 10, 2021)

I cant see how they could that that without a complete revamp to the way orders work.  Unless batches get split by department idk how it would work.  Flex is around 20% of daily sales in my store


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## Jayunderscore (Jan 10, 2021)

MrT said:


> I cant see how they could that that without a complete revamp to the way orders work.  Unless batches get split by department idk how it would work.  Flex is around 20% of daily sales in my store


I'd be interested in hearing how Small Format stores handle OPUs and then try and figure out how a chain store would do it. I expect that's how HQ would want things implemented.


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## balthrop (Jan 10, 2021)

Hardlinesmaster said:


> Spot maybe doing the instocks thing on the flex teams.


Now that is a name I have not heard in ages.  I miss INSTOCKS so bloody much.  if they were still around there would so so so much better stock control.


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## balthrop (Jan 10, 2021)

BurgerBob said:


> Yup you can't add 3 jobs onto someone and expect them to be in 3 places at once


Hold my Cosmo we are going for it. this is target after all.  we talk mad game then fall flat on our faces


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## Xanatos (Jan 10, 2021)

Jayunderscore said:


> I'd be interested in hearing how Small Format stores handle OPUs and then try and figure out how a chain store would do it. I expect that's how HQ would want things implemented.


If we are barely getting any, we assign a person to be in charge of it and do them as they come in, just like when fulfillment started years ago (before it really caught on). If it gets really busy and that one person can't keep up with it, we'll ask another to help out. If it got busier than that, get another person, etc. They just get scheduled under GM with OPU as their shift code or whatever it's called.


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## DatBoi9497 (Jan 10, 2021)

Just like 75% of the crap Target does it seems to be like it was based for a small format but they force everyone to do it. Like the "new" unload and freight system that only 1 DC in the country uses. No way any remotely busy store could do this considering most stores in my district do 1500-2000 OPU units daily right now and one does like 3500+. Also Target loves to give our 1 pack station more SFS units per pack station than all the other stores in our district and they hate giving out payroll to get rid of dedicated fulfillment tms.


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## vendordontmesswithme (Jan 10, 2021)

We have 3 stations the middle one can not be used because they are too close together.  So will adjustments be made to the amount of orders being dropped?
Hey I've always been told "there's no dumb question."   Wait for me to drink the kool-aid before y'all answer.


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## IWishIKnew (Jan 10, 2021)

I don't think it's a bad idea to have people crosstrained to fulfillment, but I can't imagine there being a change in scheduling. If you're GM, you get cross-trained for flex (most at my store already have been) and you can be scheduled for shifts under flex or be pulled in (like we were tonight) when shit gets really busy.

Store been slammed this week, in-store, OPU, SFS thanks to the stimulus checks....on the week in which hours were seriously cut and all the seasonals were let go. Not good timing, that.


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## DBZ (Jan 11, 2021)

It's my understanding that they intend to cross train people for OPU the same way they do for cashiering.


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## gman192 (Jan 11, 2021)

I honestly cannot see Flex Fulfill getting phased out as a department.  It's seriously the fastest growing segment for the corporation itself.  Three years ago in my store we had like six full-time experts and after seasonal reductions this year, we'll be sitting at about 25 peeps.  I have heard, though, that there is a big push to get regular gm/style/groc cross-trained into it.  (Like backing up at the lanes but in OPUs.) If it did get phased out, and departments did their own OPUs, who would do the packing for the SFS portion?  The receiving expert?  She's busy enough as it is at my store, at least.


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## Reshop Ninja (Jan 11, 2021)

BurgerBob said:


> Yup you can't add 3 jobs onto someone and expect them to be in 3 places at once


You're literally describing modernization. Think about it: they took the people who did just zoning and reshop and then started to make them do the the jobs of almost every other position in the store. We now have the responsibilities of the flow, signing, price change, backroom, pog and logistics teams plus some team lead duties. If Target is willing to do that then I can see them adding fulfillment to our plate. I'm already seeing team leads and etls picking batches almost every single day.


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## StyleMaven (Jan 11, 2021)

Reshop Ninja said:


> You're literally describing modernization. Think about it: they took the people who did just zoning and reshop and then started to make them do the the jobs of almost every other position in the store. We now have the responsibilities of the flow, signing, price change, backroom, pog and logistics teams plus some team lead duties. If Target is willing to do that then I can see them adding fulfillment to our plate. I'm already seeing team leads and etls picking batches almost every single day.


In my store, I NEVER see team leads or etls picking.
However, most of our softlines tms are already cross trained and pulled from their zones to pick. And, after being sent to back up cashier, assist in pushing gm freight, then pulled to pick orders, we are given minimum amounts of time to be in our own areas. Yet, we are still being continuously chastised for not doing 100% zone, reshop, price change, freight, backstock, etc in our dbo areas. 
Many of my coworkers (long time tms) have had emotional breakdowns at work. The newer tms just quit!
The opening tms and mid shifters seem to get less heat from tls & etls about completing their tasks when they are assigned duties outside of their dbo areas. Closers bear the full ire of tls & etls. Our sd expects 100% of everything completed by closers, every night. Whatever day shift doesn't finish, we must finish for them.
This past few days, several tms have adopted a "fuck it, they can just go ahead and fire me" attitude. 
I'm broken & my coworkers are too. Unfortunately, jobs are scarce in my area. And, most of us don't have a way to survive if we are suddenly jobless.


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## sunnydays (Jan 11, 2021)

StyleMaven said:


> In my store, I NEVER see team leads or etls picking.


that blows. they should

i spent the first three hours of my day today in batches instead of actually running my workcenter lol


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## seasonaldude (Jan 11, 2021)

Hardlinesmaster said:


> @seasonaldude. Any info?



I haven't heard anything.


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## Bosch (Jan 11, 2021)

sunnydays said:


> that blows. they should
> 
> i spent the first three hours of my day today in batches instead of actually running my workcenter lol



Yet they give actual fulfillment TMs 16hrs for the week.. And wonder why there are no supplies nothing is shipped on time and there are 12 open pallets most several days old when you come in for your only actual fulfillment shift of the week. And a full SFS cart of prepped items that when I searched it out, of things that should have went into boxes but somehow didn't make it in the box.. Jebus!    I did eight hours for fulfillment and the other shift was pushing freight since people call out or just don't bother showing up.

Yes 12 open pallets. I left them open.. I have found the only way to get problems fixed is for that problem to affect the numbers for that ETL/TL.. Until then nothing will be done until they are forced to.


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## slowhands (Jan 11, 2021)

DBZ said:


> It's my understanding that they intend to cross train people for OPU the same way they do for cashiering.


They still cross train for cashiering?  Havent seen much of that lately.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

My TL hadn't heard anything about all this when I asked. They were not very thrilled with the idea when I mentioned it, either, lol. 

Majority of our store is crosstrained, but that doesn't mean they should be trusted with doing any of it in non-"all hands on deck" situations. I can't even get my regular team to scan pallets out, clean/stock boxes, or stack packed boxes correctly (has no one played tetris or jenga before, like wtf?). So, really, I don't want some integrated GM-on-steroids team where they'll throw someone into Ship who was trained for 10min on OPU the one time no one else could do it...sighhhh.


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## BurgerBob (Jan 11, 2021)

Yup , all of flex knows I will pick up the odd shift for them but like don't expect  me to have their training.


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## seasonaldude (Jan 11, 2021)

Apparently, OPUs went to hell yesterday afternoon, so half the store was called in. I walked in this morning to all of my dry grocery hold locations stuffed to the gills with regular orders. Good thing I didn't have 150 grocery DPCIs in the gun with no place to put them. Oh wait...I did.

Yeah, let's just get rid of fulfillment experts. What could possibly go wrong?

Also, big shout out to whichever moron bagged salads with leaking out of date raw pork.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> Also, big shout out to whichever moron bagged salads with leaking out of date raw pork.


...what. Has this person never cooked or learned any sort of food safety ever? Like even if they never did the computer training, anyone with even a little bit of life skill would know to 1) check dates, or at the very least, 2) that blood doesn't belong on/near other food.

But yes let's integrate the fulfillment team. It's all same, right?


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## Poofresh (Jan 11, 2021)

target should just go full warehouse, and let people order thru the app.  lettign people in, making a mess in the store, and have OPU waste time looking thru gobacks, unsorted boxes, sales floor locations is just money and time being wasted.  its time to just have everyone stay in the parking lot and wait for their orders to arrive.  its time to really compete with amazon.  kill walk in store experience.  just my 2cent


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## Black Sheep 214 (Jan 11, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> Also, big shout out to whichever moron bagged salads with leaking out of date raw pork


🤢🤮


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## Poofresh (Jan 11, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> Also, big shout out to whichever moron bagged salads with leaking out of date raw pork.


thats gross dude.  i always worry about our OPU's doing cross contaminations like this.


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## vyrt (Jan 11, 2021)

Digging on workday shows the opposite and target diving more into fulfillment for the new remodels.


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## seasonaldude (Jan 11, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> ...what. Has this person never cooked or learned any sort of food safety ever? Like even if they never did the computer training, anyone with even a little bit of life skill would know to 1) check dates, or at the very least, 2) that blood doesn't belong on/near other food.
> 
> But yes let's integrate the fulfillment team. It's all same, right?



I work with idiots. I've learned to accept that fact. I have grosser grocery OPU stories. Here's some: you know how potatoes get black and mushy when they go bad? Imagine that getting picked. Seen that. Milk that's so old it has mold in it? Yeah, seen that. Mayo over two months out of date? Yup. Seen that picked. Moldy bread? Sure, why not give that to a guest? Eggs that are so obviously broken the yolks is leaking through the carton and they are also bagged with other products. Yeah, that's my store.

I could go on. Idiots. I work with idiots.

Of course when I go to leadership about this shit and suggest maybe, just maybe, we should restrict who is allowed to pick groceries I'm met with: we need our best TMs picking style. Sigh.


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## Shizle7 (Jan 11, 2021)

slowhands said:


> They still cross train for cashiering?  Havent seen much of that lately.


I was actually cross-trained for cashiering last week...


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> we need our best TMs picking style. Sigh.


Slap an RFID gun in any child's hand and they're good to go. Worst case a guest doesn't have a new swimsuit for another *gasp* few days. Give a guest food that could make them sick? That's a lawsuit. Yikes to their priorities haha.


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## SigningLady (Jan 11, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> I work with idiots. I've learned to accept that fact. I have grosser grocery OPU stories. Here's some: you know how potatoes get black and mushy when they go bad? Imagine that getting picked. Seen that. Milk that's so old it has mold in it? Yeah, seen that. Mayo over two months out of date? Yup. Seen that picked. Moldy bread? Sure, why not give that to a guest? Eggs that are so obviously broken the yolks is leaking through the carton and they are also bagged with other products. Yeah, that's my store.
> 
> I could go on. Idiots. I work with idiots.
> 
> Of course when I go to leadership about this shit and suggest maybe, just maybe, we should restrict who is allowed to pick groceries I'm met with: we need our best TMs picking style. Sigh.



Style items won't leak all over everything though....yeah, you definitely work with idiots. My condolences.


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## seasonaldude (Jan 11, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> Slap an RFID gun in any child's hand and they're good to go. Worst case a guest doesn't have a new swimsuit for another *gasp* few days. Give a guest food that could make them sick? That's a lawsuit. Yikes to their priorities haha.



Yeah, that's another issue. The children hate the RFID guns and mostly refuse to use them. And, when they are forced to scan for something, they do a quick run through and don't give the gun time to do its work.

INFs are green for the year though (by 0.03%), so it's all good, right? SIGH.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> The children hate the RFID guns and mostly refuse to use them.


Why...would you hate to use something that makes your job 10x easier? I mean, I rarely use a gun unless I legit can't find an item. But most of my team, the newer kiddos especially, have it glued to their hand. Which is a whole other problem when we only have 3 lol.

Ohhh if we integrate fulfillment into GM we'll lose the guns and finger scanners so much more often, gahhh. I already have to get on people once a week "2 wands are missing this morning", "why was there a scanner left in the breakroom last night?", etcetc. Sighhhh.


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## Snarf (Jan 11, 2021)

I'm from an OPU only store and everyone is trained for fulfillment. I don't see it being reasonable for us to get rid of the fullfillment team. We typically have 2-3 scheduled fulfillment tms throughout the day and the salesfloor is consistently having to get on, tls included. 

We didn't have dedicated fullfillment tms almost two years ago and then the salesfloor team would take 2 hour fullfillment shifts.


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## IWishIKnew (Jan 11, 2021)

StyleMaven said:


> In my store, I NEVER see team leads or etls picking.


Yeah, this sucks. Your store "leaders" suck.

My ETL spent all of last night pulling OPU, in addition to doing that managing OPU & SFS (though there's not as much micromanaging now that the seasonals are gone). ETLs & TLs (except for SETLs, obviously) are the first the jump into the queues to keep the floor TMs on task. The fact that they had to pull all of us for an hour of our shifts was unusual, but there just weren't that many people scheduled. We must have gotten approval to bring in some extra hours, as we had a couple extra TMs that weren't on the grid.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

Saw someone on reddit who's store had a fulfillment huddle about this. They had bonkers details like everyone in GM would do opu and SFS on top of their truck push for specific areas. And that an update might be coming to epick so areas of the store were sectioned out so only TMs in those areas would grab things for those orders?

Guys...I'm sensing major corporate shenanigans incoming if this is true. It makes 0 logical sense, which is why it might actually happen...


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## Bosch (Jan 11, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> Saw someone on reddit who's store had a fulfillment huddle about this. They had bonkers details like everyone in GM would do opu and SFS on top of their truck push for specific areas. And that an update might be coming to epick so areas of the store were sectioned out so only TMs in those areas would grab things for those orders?
> 
> Guys...I'm sensing major corporate shenanigans incoming if this is true. It makes 0 logical sense, which is why it might actually happen...



Might? That is down right a order from god.. They always pick the stupid option. That is what they will pick.. Oh well.. I have been looking around to get into something a little less hard on the body.. If this comes down, yeah it's time.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

Bosch said:


> Might? That is down right a order from god


Apparently their SD had 0 specifics or confirmation. Just...truck push done by 8, everyone is responsible for fulfillment, and the app is supposedly maybe changing to reflect store blocks so like 3 TMs will pick one order if they have items from all different departments?

They're rolling out these nonsense changes on a lark. There's no structure in place, no plan, no nothing. So...business as usual I guess...


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## balthrop (Jan 11, 2021)

gman192 said:


> I honestly cannot see Flex Fulfill getting phased out as a department.  It's seriously the fastest growing segment for the corporation itself.  Three years ago in my store we had like six full-time experts and after seasonal reductions this year, we'll be sitting at about 25 peeps.  I have heard, though, that there is a big push to get regular gm/style/groc cross-trained into it.  (Like backing up at the lanes but in OPUs.) If it did get phased out, and departments did their own OPUs, who would do the packing for the SFS portion?  The receiving expert?  She's busy enough as it is at my store, at least.


truly friend never underestimate the amount of stupid that can will and does come out of the mothership.  when you think you have seen the dumbest shit ever Target will take that as a challenge and out do itself. 


if we are anything we are consistently out doing ourselves in the amount of stupid shit we are forced to do.


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## MxTarget (Jan 11, 2021)

It kind of sounds like reverting to how we used to stock.  Having the truck completed by 8 isn’t modernization as one of the biggest pieces is all day stocking.  And to come clean by 8, you would have to blitz or wave stock the entire store, just like we used to do.  However, if you did that and then moved everyone over to SFS/OPU who was needed and kept those needed for presentation/pricing/etc tasks, it might work.  Also, I’ve heard of 1.5 truck sort times, which only works if you have a properly staffed inbound, which hasn’t been the case at a lot of stores.

Wouldn’t it just be Target to put us through all that modernization, just to be like jk.


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## gman192 (Jan 11, 2021)

balthrop said:


> truly friend never underestimate the amount of stupid that can will and does come out of the mothership.  when you think you have seen the dumbest shit ever Target will take that as a challenge and out do itself.
> 
> 
> if we are anything we are consistently out doing ourselves in the amount of stupid shit we are forced to do.


Seven years of Bullseye.  I'm familiar. 😂
I mean, I could see this potentially working for SFS but definitely not the 90 minute deadlines of OPU.  Overall, INF would decrease slightly (especially clothing) but everything else would get worse.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 11, 2021)

gman192 said:


> I mean, I could see this potentially working for SFS but definitely not the 90 minute deadlines of OPU.


See, I feel the opposite. We used to have opu do GM tasks when not busy all the time. Order drops, stop what you're doing, go grab the thing(s), go back to what you were doing before. Rinse, repeat. If they scaled the goaltime, or the number of people, or the way batches work then I can see that formula making a comeback just fine.

But Ship? With larger batch sizes, packing to be done, and a strict 4:30 deadline? That ain't a "okay GM peeps do it when you can, make sure truck and 1f1s are done too, tho, alright?" kinda situation lol.

This is gonna be interesting...


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## Frontlanegirl (Jan 11, 2021)

vngoghlvr said:


> I could see that working for stores with OPU only, but not with ship.  Although nothing would surprise me anymore, they will cross train everybody and either bitch that fulfillment isn't done on time or whatever else they should be working on isn't.  Our mid shift GM peeps spend most time on a lane or in opu.  Then we hear about reshops, zone, rollover, OFOs.  Well you can't have it both ways, people can only wear so many hats.  And if you want something done fast and efficiently, you should have the training and payroll to back it up.  Neither of which Spot excells at anymore.


We’ve had days where everyone in GM is doing fulfillment, so then no GM work gets done. We have plenty of TM’s cross trained for flex, it is more of an issue of not enough hours.


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## Boxman (Jan 11, 2021)

Frontlanegirl said:


> We’ve had days where everyone in GM is doing fulfillment, so then no GM work gets done. We have plenty of TM’s cross trained for flex, it is more of an issue of not enough hours.


The hours excuse is dumb.  My store constantly pulls the whole store to help SFS because we cut hours each week from the Fulfillment work center, underposting our schedule.  

Having GM do SFS isn't the solution.  This will be a disaster, if true.  

They should do the opposite.  Double down on Fulfillment.  Give it more hours, more tms, set shifts, and separate it from the rest of the store.  Like if there are no orders everyone goes home early.  If there are more orders everyone stays late.  Make it a more "traditional" warehouse position.  Separate it MORE from the store.  It would excel.  

Oh well....spot going to spot.


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## Yetive (Jan 12, 2021)

People don't order by department.


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## Tessa120 (Jan 12, 2021)

Yetive said:


> People don't order by department.


I think what was meant is if you order shampoo, a shower curtain, swim goggles and a bikini, the person in beauty picks the shampoo, the person in home gets the shower curtain, sporting goods gets the goggles and style gets the swimsuit.  Then it all comes magically together in the OPU hold as each piece locates the others and they teleport into being one order.


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## GRC (Jan 12, 2021)

Yeah, it sounds to me that basically this would be adding doing SFS to everyone's workload, but they would only be getting items in their respective areas. I'm not sure how that would work for OPU though, perhaps they would still keep people for OPU, but that would make sense and the rest of the whole idea doesn't so who knows what they'll do about that.

That said, hopefully this is just some sort of a trial/experiment being done at a few stores, and they don't end up doing it everywhere.


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## rd123 (Jan 12, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> Why...would you hate to use something that makes your job 10x easier? I mean, I rarely use a gun unless I legit can't find an item. But most of my team, the newer kiddos especially, have it glued to their hand. Which is a whole other problem when we only have 3 lol.
> 
> Ohhh if we integrate fulfillment into GM we'll lose the guns and finger scanners so much more often, gahhh. I already have to get on people once a week "2 wands are missing this morning", "why was there a scanner left in the breakroom last night?", etcetc. Sighhhh.


We had a rfid gun left on a three tier for a whole day in backroom near the baler until I finally understood it was abandoned and returned to the device room . 😕


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## DBZ (Jan 12, 2021)

Tessa120 said:


> I think what was meant is if you order shampoo, a shower curtain, swim goggles and a bikini, the person in beauty picks the shampoo, the person in home gets the shower curtain, sporting goods gets the goggles and style gets the swimsuit.  Then it all comes magically together in the OPU hold as each piece locates the others and they teleport into being one order.



Oh that would be entertaining *eyeroll*. The two girls who work at night in beauty are dumb. My dog could do their work better and I don't have a dog. When they come to GS to put away reshop, they are putting pants in Market, bullseye in chem, and their eism in donate.


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## Times Up (Jan 12, 2021)

DBZ said:


> It's my understanding that they intend to cross train people for OPU the same way they do for cashiering.



So 10 minutes of training?


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## MrT (Jan 12, 2021)

Jayunderscore said:


> I'd be interested in hearing how Small Format stores handle OPUs and then try and figure out how a chain store would do it. I expect that's how HQ would want things implemented.


I think its possible if they keep ship separate.  Ship forecasts are generally pretty close so its easy to properly schedule.  Opu forecast is impossible rn with covid, grocery opu, and just how many people are now used to drive up.  Taking flex hours from opu and putting it in gm and market might doable but id assume they try and cut hours and itll just be even more work and more stress.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 12, 2021)

My thought is: why now? Fulfillment is already GM (like how beauty and tron are specialty sales but separate grids), we pull people from the floor or give people to push as needed; it's already a "working" system. Maybe it really will just be a pooling of hours with scheduled shift markers. But the people mentioning these changes on reddit have got very extreme stories to tell so far. 

So, asants maybe? Like how some stores read the guidelines and give fulfillment to front end leadership and some stores give it to GM? Or how drive ups are sometimes a guest service thing but, like at my store, fulfillment is responsible for them? Idk.

Whoever gets leadership to cough up a corporate email on this first wins major kudos, so please share asap lol.


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## seasonaldude (Jan 12, 2021)

Tessa120 said:


> I think what was meant is if you order shampoo, a shower curtain, swim goggles and a bikini, the person in beauty picks the shampoo, the person in home gets the shower curtain, sporting goods gets the goggles and style gets the swimsuit.



In theory, that's a really good idea. As fulfillment I really like the possibilty. For example, let's say there is a Circle deal going on Pillowfort so people are ordering the cheap ass kid's dinnerware in kitchen. (I'm hitting real close to home for fulfillment peeps.) Well, if the kitchen DBO sucks, falls behind in frieght, never scans his outs and lows that makes for a really bad week for fulfillment. If someone orders 10 blue plates that we're supposed to have 37 of, but that we haven't sold in 50+ days and we don't have any, then why should that be MY problem. Yet, it counts against my metrics. If the kitchen DBO had to pick that order, it becomes their problem. Now, they have incentive to do their job right and complete all their routines on a regular basis. This should lower INFs.

But, that's all in theory. In reality, even the best DBO can't get everything done and done right all the time. Even if they could, they can't be in the store all the time and always know what happens when they aren't there. That's where fulfillment experts come in. We know how to find stuff when things aren't done right. That's what makes us "experts."  It's why we're needed.


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## Boxman (Jan 12, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> In theory, that's a really good idea. As fulfillment I really like the possibilty. For example, let's say there is a Circle deal going on Pillowfort so people are ordering the cheap ass kid's dinnerware in kitchen. (I'm hitting real close to home for fulfillment peeps.) Well, if the kitchen DBO sucks, falls behind in frieght, never scans his outs and lows that makes for a really bad week for fulfillment. If someone orders 10 blue plates that we're supposed to have 37 of, but that we haven't sold in 50+ days and we don't have any, then why should that be MY problem. Yet, it counts against my metrics. If the kitchen DBO had to pick that order, it becomes their problem. Now, they have incentive to do their job right and complete all their routines on a regular basis. This should lower INFs.


I get your point, but I'd argue that having them do fulfillment as a way to hold them accountable for doing their job in the first place is all sorts of jacked up.  

TL/ETL should be holding them accountable.  Daily if necessary and if they aren't keeping up with freight, scanning outs, etc document that shit and work them out.  

That's what is so Spot about all of this.  Don't address the real root of the problem to begin with.  Just come up with some stupid roundabout bandaid solution and call it good.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Jan 12, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> I've heard rumors that Fulfillment as an independent department will be phased out and replaced with cross training?
> If anybody's heard this please confirm and add more info.
> Also, from a perspective of hours and not things being crazy, would your average team member benefit? what about fulfillment TMs?


Maybe in stores that do little fulfillment. We do thousands a day. We have a large team that are still getting 30 at least this month.


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## JiJi (Jan 12, 2021)

If they did that at my store, they'd probably just schedule us under GM or whatever and have us do what we've been doing tbh. I know more than some of the DBOs do with their own depts, especially with the unlocated backstock items - thanks to seasonals.


----------



## FlexThis (Jan 12, 2021)

Bosch said:


> Might? That is down right a order from god.. They always pick the stupid option. That is what they will pick.. Oh well.. I have been looking around to get into something a little less hard on the body.. If this comes down, yeah it's time.


I'm with you!


----------



## OrderSickUp (Jan 12, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> Saw someone on reddit who's store had a fulfillment huddle about this. They had bonkers details like everyone in GM would do opu and SFS on top of their truck push for specific areas. And that an update might be coming to epick so areas of the store were sectioned out so only TMs in those areas would grab things for those orders?
> 
> Guys...I'm sensing major corporate shenanigans incoming if this is true. It makes 0 logical sense, which is why it might actually happen...



I have so many words, yet I also have no words ...


----------



## Frontlanegirl (Jan 12, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> In theory, that's a really good idea. As fulfillment I really like the possibilty. For example, let's say there is a Circle deal going on Pillowfort so people are ordering the cheap ass kid's dinnerware in kitchen. (I'm hitting real close to home for fulfillment peeps.) Well, if the kitchen DBO sucks, falls behind in frieght, never scans his outs and lows that makes for a really bad week for fulfillment. If someone orders 10 blue plates that we're supposed to have 37 of, but that we haven't sold in 50+ days and we don't have any, then why should that be MY problem. Yet, it counts against my metrics. If the kitchen DBO had to pick that order, it becomes their problem. Now, they have incentive to do their job right and complete all their routines on a regular basis. This should lower INFs.
> 
> But, that's all in theory. In reality, even the best DBO can't get everything done and done right all the time. Even if they could, they can't be in the store all the time and always know what happens when they aren't there. That's where fulfillment experts come in. We know how to find stuff when things aren't done right. That's what makes us "experts."  It's why we're needed.


Working fulfillment you learn really quickly sales floor errors.  I once had to look for a product that had 10 locations and the product was not in any of those locations.  You learn where product is mislabeled or unlocated.


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## slowhands (Jan 13, 2021)

Link to the reddit thread(s)?


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## DatBoi9497 (Jan 13, 2021)

Fulfillment should be used to judge how well each area is doing, but instead somehow we are blamed for the fact that the DBO's/DC/guest service/cashiers cannot do their job properly. Unless only one or two people have bad numbers consistently, each area should be held accountable for bad infs. You can't tell that half of bed/bath/domestics is unlocated in the backroom by BRLA or looking at the salesfloor because they just overstock every item into the empty spaces, even though I've complained for half a year about it, or whenever they flex something on the other side of the store and don't tie it and the home location is empty but there's 30 OH. Also if a brain-dead fulfillment tm who has the exact isle location and delivery date can't find it, how can a guest?


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## BurgerBob (Jan 13, 2021)

Lmao.  I have this issue when doing flex, . I'll be looking for a item and I look at its details. "Last time audited, 162 days ago, 5 on hand. "
 But I'm clearly looking at a wide blank space on the sales floor with none back stocked and the dbo being like "nah we haven't had that item in a month"

TL still is being a pain in the ass about  the inf.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 13, 2021)

Links as asked for!

First mention on reddit

Huddle where changes were mentioned

Only mentions I've seen so far besides this thread being started.

Edit: people in the comment confirm the changes have taken place in their stores, and have given some details on how it works for them...


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## vngoghlvr (Jan 13, 2021)

This makes no sense, especially because corporate was adding more Fulfillment TLs after last spring.  I have enough problems with my team, I don't want to be responsible for the DBOs too.  Fuck that.


----------



## OmegamanX (Jan 13, 2021)

This sounds like a nightmare


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## RunForACallBox (Jan 14, 2021)

Sounds like a mass exodus of people quitting.


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## dabug (Jan 14, 2021)

Okay I didn’t read all of the replies, but here goes an unpopular opinion: You work for Target, so do whatever they tell you to or quit.


----------



## YankeRaider (Jan 14, 2021)

I put my 2 weeks in as a grocery TL, and on Monday the STL had a meeting with the ETLs and TLs, about this.  Of course being my last week, I was not part of the meeting, instead held the store down during the hour long meeting, I heard about it through my TMs.  When I asked my ETL I got no real answers.

Another of the many issues popping up, this last 2 weeks, confirming I'm making the right choice for leaving.

I see this as most have in this thread;

My Market team might get 1-2 fulfillment TMs adding 30-70 hr of payroll a week, for 80-100 hrs of added workload a week.  We are already spending 18-20 on Truck unload/sort, after we blew-up the unload team with  9-10 RDC trucks a weeks, 21-35 hrs of Guest 1st/Back-up cashier a week, another 7-10 hrs of helping out All Store/ "One Store one Team" e.t. making bales/cleaning fixture room/or whatever is needed.., now 80-100 hrs of Fulfillment?... 

I do not see this being successful.  I think TMs are already at the tipping point of burnout and stress levels are high.

STL/ETL thought process;
"30 mins is the expectation, but I saw you do this in 20 the other day" (hauling ass stressed to the max, trying to get to lunch before 5 hrs)
"20 mins is the new expectation."
"If you can do it in 20 mins, let's try for 15 mins..."
"Hey I'm going to have to document this, because you didn't meet the 15 min expectation."

"I was able to do it in 15 mins the other day , so you should be able to do it also" (actually it was closer to 25 mins and you didn't backstock or bale your boxes. You just pushed the u-boat to the back, and the next day chastised/documented the DBO in the area for haveinig Sh!t u-boats in the backroom area.) 😅🤣😢😤😡🥵🥶😰😵🥴🤒☠️


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## JiJi (Jan 14, 2021)

BurgerBob said:


> Lmao.  I have this issue when doing flex, . I'll be looking for a item and I look at its details. "Last time audited, 162 days ago, 5 on hand. "
> But I'm clearly looking at a wide blank space on the sales floor with none back stocked and the dbo being like "nah we haven't had that item in a month"
> 
> TL still is being a pain in the ass about  the inf.


last audited 273 days ago
no delivery date/to be delivered date
last sold 629 days ago
5 OH (0 in back, 2 on floor)
ಠ_ಠ​


----------



## Tessa120 (Jan 14, 2021)

dabug said:


> Okay I didn’t read all of the replies, but here goes an unpopular opinion: You work for Target, so do whatever they tell you to or quit.


People can be angry about being set up to fail.  People can care enough about doing a good job that the no-win scenario actually hurts.  People can be angry that the tools needed for success are being held out of reach and yet people are being punished for not reaching the tools.


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## Bosch (Jan 14, 2021)

Tessa120 said:


> People can be angry about being set up to fail.  People can care enough about doing a good job that the no-win scenario actually hurts.  People can be angry that the tools needed for success are being held out of reach and yet people are being punished for not reaching the tools.



This right here.. I get downright bitchy when I know I am being set up.  Why are your INF's so high for HBA and Cosmetics? Well there are five pallets of repacks. No one is working them.  The response? So you haven't look fast enough? Yes they expect me to search through five pallets of mixed up repacks that were stacked with no reason other than to get the mess that fell over and spilled on to other pallet spaces out of the way for a single bottle of vitamins. Then repeat that batch after batch and while you do that don't fall behind on picking the orders cause you did have three people but now it's just you. But orders are still at pandemic levels aka heavy.  Kindly go fuck yourself.


----------



## IWishIKnew (Jan 14, 2021)

This probably isn't feasible, but cosmetics should totally be RFID, because it's so many tiny things in such a large area (this includes in a bunch of repacks). I had some fake nails the other day that were in freight and I got super lucky that they happened to be in the most accessible repack (out of 9 on the u boat). What could easily have taken a half hour or more took only a few minutes, but it was pure luck.


----------



## CassRoslyn (Jan 15, 2021)

dabug said:


> Okay I didn’t read all of the replies, but here goes an unpopular opinion: You work for Target, so do whatever they tell you to or quit.


Well aren't you a ball of sunshine. How about people can be concerned about their job changing out of the blue? Or just let them be worried about their workcenter going to hell for bad decisions? 

Of course everyone here will do their job or move on to greener pastures lol. Doesn't mean we're not allowed to talk about it, yeah?


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## FlowTeamChick (Jan 15, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> In reality, even the best DBO can't get everything done and done right all the time. Even if they could, they can't be in the store all the time and always know what happens when they aren't there.


And this is why I'm always glad when one of our ship TMs finds me in my area to ask if we're really all out of something.  I'm good but I'm not perfect and I miss stuff sometimes.
As to one more thing being added to my plate, I really hope ship stays as is.  Our ship TMs (now that we're past the seasonal crush) are good at what they do.  And, as noted, they sometimes catch things I miss, which I appreciate.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 15, 2021)

FlowTeamChick said:


> As to one more thing being added to my plate, I really hope ship stays as is.


My best guess is that if all areas are combined, Ship vets will remain scheduled to do fulfillment things just within the payroll of GM? I mean...I'd hope. Dbos have enough to do, so fingers crossed schedule makers do their thing and this is just a change mostly in name only.

Plus, I'm sure every store has areas where the thought of the dbo doing opu or Ship makes us fulfillment vets go "oh no, please no". Heck, our softlines hasnt pushed RTW in almost 2 weeks I don't want them touching my department lol.


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## MxTarget (Jan 15, 2021)

If this is all true, it doesn’t really sound like the fulfillment position going away, but we are all becoming fulfillment plus addition of sales floor tasks.  So the focus is to get tasks done as soon as possible then move to fulfillment.  Hey, at least we won’t have to back-up cashier...

It kind of sounds like modernization needs to modernize to being 💯 fulfillment centric...


----------



## Bosch (Jan 15, 2021)

MxTarget said:


> If this is all true, it doesn’t really sound like the fulfillment position going away, but we are all becoming fulfillment plus addition of sales floor tasks.  So the focus is to get tasks done as soon as possible then move to fulfillment.  Hey, at least we won’t have to back-up cashier...
> 
> It kind of sounds like modernization needs to modernize to being 💯 fulfillment centric...



I would love if DBO's could DBO and be allowed to just get their area to the way it should be and let us who know where everything pretty much is do the picking/packing. We understand the flow. Cause if you guys are on it, it really make our job easy in one way we can pick faster cause things are where they are supposed to be.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Jan 15, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> My best guess is that if all areas are combined, Ship vets will remain scheduled to do fulfillment things just within the payroll of GM? I mean...I'd hope. Dbos have enough to do, so fingers crossed schedule makers do their thing and this is just a change mostly in name only.
> 
> Plus, I'm sure every store has areas where the thought of the dbo doing opu or Ship makes us fulfillment vets go "oh no, please no". Heck, our softlines hasnt pushed RTW in almost 2 weeks I don't want them touching my department lol.


Someone still has to reorganize all the picks into orders and pack them. They’ll move the fast pickers to gm and leave fast packers in sfs.


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## Tarjayy (Jan 15, 2021)

Ashfromoldsite said:


> Someone still has to reorganize all the picks into orders and pack them. They’ll move the fast pickers to gm and leave fast packers in sfs.


And what about all the slow pickers and packers that drain the payroll?


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## DatBoi9497 (Jan 15, 2021)

Tarjayy said:


> And what about all the slow pickers and packers that drain the payroll?


Electric chair


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## SigningLady (Jan 16, 2021)

Tarjayy said:


> And what about all the slow pickers and packers that drain the payroll?



Cattle prod.


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## Bosch (Jan 16, 2021)

Ashfromoldsite said:


> Someone still has to reorganize all the picks into orders and pack them. They’ll move the fast pickers to gm and leave fast packers in sfs.


The problem my store has is that the fastest packers don't get all the items in the actual boxes. I am a bit slower but actually get the items in the damn box.. I just love walking in the next morning and finding prepped items left on the carts. When searched out finding they are parts of orders.


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## Far from newbie (Jan 16, 2021)

I remember reading in a modernization workbook years ago “fulfill online orders” as a GM DBO responsibility.  When I questioned it I was told - ignore that for now, we’re not ready yet.  
Well, fast forward 3 years, I think they think we are ready.  Newsflash:  NOT in the least bit !!!  

Not one DBO knows what price change is....either someone works 8 hours and clears the entire list or every TL does some but it is definitely NOT in DBO routines yet - heck, reshop only gets picked up once per day, only half the 1:1‘s get pulled - trying, we really are trying, but the day just isn’t long enough ! 
 If an entire day is eaten up with guest assistance and back-up cashiering then it all goes to H Double hockey sticks....

I’m still struggling fulfilling all the TL duties and I’m NOT supposed to task !  so a typical day looks like this:

Unlock door, shut alarm, Punch in and ...........

Get equipment, sign in, Answer phone, let TM‘s in, unlock door, print a grid, label equipment sign in sheet, distribute keys, monitor truck unload, monitor SFS levels, move TM around to cover call-outs, 239, guest assistance, vendor assistance, Brand walk and DBO check-ins, workload assignments, set expectations utilizing push  time estimate report,  give out break schedules, read emails, print price change, scan/activate price change, hang price change, ticket clearance,move clearance, scan clearance endcap, process salvage, wrap the salvage pallet, pull discontinued merch, locate discontinued merch, move discontinued merch, complete audits, back up cashier, get others to back-up cashier, cover front lanes, answer cashier inquiries, answer guest inquiries, answer vendor inquiries, override punch ins that weren’t changed on the schedule, check in with entering tm’s to ask COVID questions, read e-mails, send e-mail updates, send required photo’s, complete PCV by noon, check BRLA, list errors and fix or assign fixes, randomly check br locations for errors, profile br aisles, audit SFQ and sf cap, map SPL locations, 
print SPL labels, assign/set SPL, fill endcaps, ensure 1:1 is pulled twice per day or pull, ensure re-shop is collected three times per day or deliver.

LUNCHTIME - a chance to clean office, read correspondence, eat, organize work, answer “I’m at lunch” on the walkie 3X, check in with HR for trainings due

lunch over:  remind tm’s to complete training, ensure salesfloor is clean, trash is cleared, backstock is truly backstock and located, write “you” cards, 
train a new Tm or a current Tm on a new process, validate work completed, correctly, pick a few OPU’s to help, sit in a status meeting,
confirm all signing is up, have attendance conversations, enter attendance and performance PDD’s, plan week ahead workload, be sure to leave on time.

yippee - 7 hour shift over and there were NO complications, good day.

REALITY - 2 of those things got done.


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## RunForACallBox (Jan 16, 2021)

Modernization has been the absolute worst thing to happen to Target. Someone in HQ with some fucking sense help us out.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 16, 2021)

RunForACallBox said:


> Modernization has been the absolute worst thing to happen to Target. Someone in HQ with some fucking sense help us out.


I wonder if they still work for spot?


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## JiJi (Jan 16, 2021)

Hardlinesmaster said:


> I wonder if they still work for spot?


If they had any sense, they're probably not working here anymore


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## RunForACallBox (Jan 16, 2021)

Hardlinesmaster said:


> I wonder if they still work for spot?


I thought Brian Cornell threw Janna Potts under the bus that she was the architect behind Modernization, which I thought with the backlash of it, forcered her an early retirement? 🤔🤔


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## balthrop (Jan 16, 2021)

RunForACallBox said:


> I thought Brian Cornell threw Janna Potts under the bus that she was the architect behind Modernization, which I thought with the backlash of it, forcered her an early retirement? 🤔🤔


she got the "spend time with family" IIRC.

and I do think the brain trust that came up with End to End, Store Modernization etc have for the most part left the company to seek employment elsewhere.


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## IcePeasant (Jan 17, 2021)

I just heard about this last week...i think they called it end to end team for GM, forcing all stores in my area to do it except those who are consistently green which was a handful. Someone in a neighboring group had a hand in creating modernization - still with the company, and its a wonder why that area is not doing so well.


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## IcePeasant (Jan 17, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> where did you hear about it? planning on asking my ETL and TL about it tomorrow


I’m a flock leader - calls and emails last week.


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## YugTegrat (Jan 18, 2021)

I really want to meet the people who come up with these decisions. It's more than obvious that GM is overworked as it is. Lots of metrics that were green prior to Modernization still haven't quite recovered from when they tanked during the rollout.

It really just doesn't make sense to add even more to the plate. In my store, this has seemingly already started with all TMs in GM/Inbound being expected to pick at least one batch before they leave for the day. Fulfillment's hours dropped severely and multiple TMs from that department have already been put into GM or F&B. It's beyond stressful for leaders in the building now compared to how it was before.

I mean, I get it. I understand why they're doing this. Outside of Q4, there's no need to have a dozen or so TMs in fulfillment since the orders aren't going to drop as nearly as heavily as they did before. They would rather have more GM and F&B Experts that can do _more _for the company than keep Fulfillment Experts around and throw them in those areas when they aren't busy. It makes a lot of sense on paper.

.. except no, it doesn't, because GM and F&B still can't fully complete the workload they had prior to this. So what the fuck?


----------



## slowhands (Jan 18, 2021)

YugTegrat said:


> I really want to meet the people who come up with these decisions. It's more than obvious that GM is overworked as it is. Lots of metrics that were green prior to Modernization still haven't quite recovered from when they tanked during the rollout.
> 
> It really just doesn't make sense to add even more to the plate. In my store, this has seemingly already started with all TMs in GM/Inbound being expected to pick at least one batch before they leave for the day. Fulfillment's hours dropped severely and multiple TMs from that department have already been put into GM or F&B. It's beyond stressful for leaders in the building now compared to how it was before.
> 
> ...


Instead of holding gm accountable for their work, they want Flex experts to cover their asses since they know we work harder.  That seems to be the bottom line here, as i see it.

At least, thats what would happen at my store if they try this.


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## SigningLady (Jan 18, 2021)

slowhands said:


> Instead of holding gm accountable for their work, they want Flex experts to cover their asses since they know we work harder.  That seems to be the bottom line here, as i see it.
> 
> At least, thats what would happen at my store if they try this.



It's not always about holding an area accountable, though it is most definitely Target's way of fixing things to just put a bandaid over it and call it good. Depending on the area of GM and the time of year, it can be incredibly difficult to accomplish all the tasks, all the time. Even for the people who work their asses off.


----------



## DatBoi9497 (Jan 18, 2021)

YugTegrat said:


> I mean, I get it. I understand why they're doing this. Outside of Q4, there's no need to have a dozen or so TMs in fulfillment since the orders aren't going to drop as nearly as heavily as they did before. They would rather have more GM and F&B Experts that can do _more _for the company than keep Fulfillment Experts around and throw them in those areas when they aren't busy. It makes a lot of sense on paper.


I would argue that we are still as busy as we were during christmas, at least at my store, we still are doing 2000-4000 opu units each day with now more sfs because we were such a heavy opu store during q4. Our fulfilled sales are at least 20k each day and thats only like 10% of our total sales, and our pick on time is rarely green anymore. They give us like 8 people on the weekends and our pick on time is 30%. We may not need to have more people than gm anymore because there aren't a bunch of slow seasonals running around but we need more than 6 people to not struggle everyday.


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## YugTegrat (Jan 18, 2021)

DatBoi9497 said:


> I would argue that we are still as busy as we were during christmas, at least at my store, we still are doing 2000-4000 opu units each day with now more sfs because we were such a heavy opu store during q4. Our fulfilled sales are at least 20k each day and thats only like 10% of our total sales, and our pick on time is rarely green anymore. They give us like 8 people on the weekends and our pick on time is 30%. We may not need to have more people than gm anymore because there aren't a bunch of slow seasonals running around but we need more than 6 people to not struggle everyday.



They (and I) understand that fulfillment workload is still pretty heavy (especially in OPU-focused stores since there's no way to equally distribute orders), but the problem is rather than make sure fulfillment is properly staffed to handle it on most days and then have those TMs help out in other areas when it isn't, they want to cut fulfillment and instead increase staffing for GM and integrate flex into the existing workload.

Except GM can't complete the existing workload and the increase in staffing doesn't mean anything under Jan - Feb payroll.. which probably won't get any better until Q3. At my store, the originally allocated hours in March of last year were just as bad as they were in January. COVID-19 is the only reason most stores saw a massive increase in hours (and overtime) during that time, and that won't be the case this year.


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## DatBoi9497 (Jan 18, 2021)

This could be something that works for stores that do less in sales, because opu heavy stores have more foot traffic and trying to lob fulfillment in with each work center won't work at a store like mine that does 140k on a slow day without increases in payroll


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## seasonaldude (Jan 18, 2021)

Do we have any official word on this? @Hardlinesmaster @allnew2 I'd love some actual details, such as is ePick going to change to make it possible for DBOs to pick their own areas and only their own areas? Who does RTS? Who does STS? Who is responsible for maintaining the OPU hold area? Who is responsible for cleaning and replenishing SFS supplies? Are forecasts going to change such that it will be possible to properly allocate hours between departments to account for the extra work, i.e., we forecast 150 style units on a given day so they get another 5 hours of payroll and we anticipate 1500 F&B units on the same day so they get another 50 hours of payroll, while we're only expecting 30 items in Beauty so just toss them a half an hour? Or is it just going to be left up to SDs to somehow distribute "fairly?"


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## 60SecondsRemaining (Jan 18, 2021)

BurgerBob said:


> Yup you can't add 3 jobs onto someone and expect them to be in 3 places at once



This has been the general MO for like two decades.  Eliminate three roles and mash them into one new one.


----------



## allnew2 (Jan 18, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> Do we have any official word on this? @Hardlinesmaster @allnew2 I'd love some actual details, such as is ePick going to change to make it possible for DBOs to pick their own areas and only their own areas? Who does RTS? Who does STS? Who is responsible for maintaining the OPU hold area? Who is responsible for cleaning and replenishing SFS supplies? Are forecasts going to change such that it will be possible to properly allocate hours between departments to account for the extra work, i.e., we forecast 150 style units on a given day so they get another 5 hours of payroll and we anticipate 1500 F&B units on the same day so they get another 50 hours of payroll, while we're only expecting 30 items in Beauty so just toss them a half an hour? Or is it just going to be left up to SDs to somehow distribute "fairly?"


I have not heard anything not even as a gossip. I don’t know how that would be possible to be honest  especially in my little store would not be fisible even if you  distribute the hours to gm with everything that they have to do that’s the last thing they would need.


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## jenna (Jan 18, 2021)

slowhands said:


> Instead of holding gm accountable for their work,* they want Flex experts to cover their asses since they know we work harder.*  That seems to be the bottom line here, as i see it.
> 
> At least, thats what would happen at my store if they try this.




There are about 2 rockstars on SFS in my store.  That's it.  And they have no idea how much shit a good GM DBO has to put up with and handle within a 4 hour shift.  I know those two SFS tms are amazing, though.

Most of our SFS tms are coasting.  I can see it in the stats.  I can see it when I am blowing away their stats, and picking at almost double their speed while I maintain green INFs.


----------



## jenna (Jan 18, 2021)

seasonaldude said:


> Do we have any official word on this? @Hardlinesmaster @allnew2 I'd love some actual details, such as is ePick going to change to make it possible for DBOs to pick their own areas and only their own areas? Who does RTS? Who does STS? Who is responsible for maintaining the OPU hold area? Who is responsible for cleaning and replenishing SFS supplies? Are forecasts going to change such that it will be possible to properly allocate hours between departments to account for the extra work, i.e., we forecast 150 style units on a given day so they get another 5 hours of payroll and we anticipate 1500 F&B units on the same day so they get another 50 hours of payroll, while we're only expecting 30 items in Beauty so just toss them a half an hour? *Or is it just going to be left up to SDs to somehow distribute "fairly?"*



Whelp.  I am even more screwed if that's the case.


----------



## jenna (Jan 18, 2021)

60SecondsRemaining said:


> This has been the general MO for like two decades.  Eliminate three roles and mash them into one new one.


and do it all in a 5 hour shift!

: lol sob :


----------



## Rarejem (Jan 18, 2021)

slowhands said:


> Instead of holding gm accountable for their work, they want Flex experts to cover their asses since they know we work harder.  That seems to be the bottom line here, as i see it.
> 
> At least, thats what would happen at my store if they try this.


Please stop with the "we work harder".  No, you don't.  You work differently.  Your expectations are different.  They are different jobs. If you haven't worked in GM, you sincerely do not know what their work entails, what their routines are, or what the expectations are.  The bottom line is that hours across the store are cut and those doing the scheduling are trying to figure out a way to best get the work done with those who are best able to get it done.  Most, not all, but most flex tm's are not trained to do the other gm work such as pog sets, backstocking, price change, defects, etc. nop flex with store ties, so they will use tm's that are more global in their training because picking batches is very similar than pulling a batch and an easily transferred skill. Also, gm picking flex does not reflect in any way flex experts covering anyone's ass.  Anyone who picks a flex will be documented in the same way so accountability is present.


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## IcePeasant (Jan 18, 2021)

I think this is going to be another discretion up to each Group/District/Director just like everything else in modernization has been. 
Each store I’ve been at has been different in terms of who owns what, how things are ran, what expectations are. Even now I think GM presentation is setting cosmetics so what’s the whole point of having beauty team members and end to end workload? It’ll be interesting to see all this play out. Just saw a commercial for spot - “Team work that works” Target has never been more far away from the term team than ever IMO. So much disconnect and no communication.


----------



## CassRoslyn (Jan 18, 2021)

Rarejem said:


> Most, not all, but most flex tm's are not trained to do the other gm work such as pog sets, backstocking, price change, defects, etc.


Eh, that's asants. All my flex TMs are taught all of this (besides, perhaps, pog), as we do GM work when fulfillment is slow. I personally teach all of them to defect, pull, and backstock as part of regular flex training because they're often skills we need day to day as well.

Also, picking a batch might be similar to regular GM tasks but it's a lot harder to find things that aren't located (properly). That's a skill that's hard learned and developed over time by any flex TM worth their hours. 



IcePeasant said:


> I think this is going to be another discretion up to each Group/District/Director just like everything else in modernization has been.
> Each store I’ve been at has been different in terms of who owns what, how things are ran, what expectations are. Even now I think GM presentation is setting cosmetics so what’s the whole point of having beauty team members and end to end workload?


Agreed! And same for my store with presentation doing the reset for beauty right now haha. It's all dependent on leadership, store and district, to interpret whatever the heck corporate is spouting.


----------



## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 18, 2021)

Nothing found on workbench, @seasonaldude. @gsa4lyfe heard anything?


----------



## IcePeasant (Jan 18, 2021)

Only thing I’ve seen was this from the Q1 overview - Structure changes will be implemented in a phased and adjusted approach starting in Q1 with additional Fulfillment and HR leadership support. Broader structures changes will take place in late Q2 based on 2020 sales performance and future sales projections. Look for more information starting in February. - if you’re on a workstation, try searching in Sharepoint, loads more information on there than shown on just workbench.


----------



## gsa4lyfe (Jan 18, 2021)

Hardlinesmaster said:


> Nothing found on workbench, @seasonaldude. @gsa4lyfe heard anything?


Nothing I’ve seen officially but I would expect some structure changes after the fiscal year. I would assume additional Gm leadership around fulfillment or separating it into its own umbrella.


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## Frontlanegirl (Jan 18, 2021)

IcePeasant said:


> Only thing I’ve seen was this from the Q1 overview - Structure changes will be implemented in a phased and adjusted approach starting in Q1 with additional Fulfillment and HR leadership support. Broader structures changes will take place in late Q2 based on 2020 sales performance and future sales projections. Look for more information starting in February. - if you’re on a workstation, try searching in Sharepoint, loads more information on there than shown on just workbench.


What is the HR leadership support?


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## balthrop (Jan 18, 2021)

Frontlanegirl said:


> What is the HR leadership support?


out of that sentence you can drop leadership and support both of those are foreign concepts at Target.


----------



## IcePeasant (Jan 18, 2021)

Frontlanegirl said:


> What is the HR leadership support?


Not 100% sure. I’ve heard talks for a few years of getting rid of HR ETL roles in my area but never seen it come to life. Not sure what they’ve got up their sleeves.


----------



## Frontlanegirl (Jan 18, 2021)

balthrop said:


> out of that sentence you can drop leadership and support both of those are foreign concepts at Target.


Yes, there is a difference between a manager and a leader. You know the ones you want to work with are leaders.


----------



## allnew2 (Jan 18, 2021)

IcePeasant said:


> Even now I think GM presentation is setting cosmetics so what’s the whole point of having beauty team members and end to end workload?


You do realize that the workload for that transition is about 205h right? I would like to see you do it without help. You can only work so much ahead and you would still fall behind.


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## allnew2 (Jan 18, 2021)

CassRoslyn said:


> Agreed! And same for my store with presentation doing the reset for beauty right now haha.


Again you have no idea the moves and workload that needs to be done for cosmetics/skincare transition . Beauty couldn’t do it on their own even if there were 2 people or3 . Especially if they don’t know how to strategize what to set  and utilizing the map. One thing is to do revision and salesplaners. And totally different for a transition when the department definitely needs support.


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## CassRoslyn (Jan 18, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Again you have no idea the moves and workload that needs to be done for cosmetics/skincare transition . Beauty couldn’t do it on their own even if there were 2 people or3 . Especially if they don’t know how to strategize what to set  and utilizing the map. One thing is to do revision and salesplaners. And totally different for a transition when the department definitely needs support.


I know. The point of the comment was that corporate shoves duties on dbos without the bigger picture in place. Resets need a larger team, and our beauty TMs are being given that at the expense of other freight being worked. No one, least of all me, is saying beauty can or _should_ do it alone. But since plano was absorbed into GM...kinda like they want flex to be seemingly...it's not so cut and dry between corporate policy and actual implementation.


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## IcePeasant (Jan 18, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> You do realize that the workload for that transition is about 205h right? I would like to see you do it without help. You can only work so much ahead and you would still fall behind.


Yes I do and I’m not disagreeing - I’m stating from what our OD stated and what stores in my area have been doing for a while, that SS/VML/Consultants should be responsible for the 150h set, yet The SD at my particular store wanted GM DBOs to handle transitions when they couldn’t even finish their normal duty of unloading and finishing a truck and resorted to GM and having a “plano” team again. Pretty sure the toys workload last week is incomplete and yet we must continue to push forward. EDIT:*their exact wording was Specialty Team/Consultants/VML Required to do set*

and by the OD’s mentality of SS setting that in my mind means SS should have TMs in the three respective SS areas (style, tech, and beauty) all cross trained in between.


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## 60SecondsRemaining (Jan 18, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Again you have no idea the moves and workload that needs to be done for cosmetics/skincare transition . Beauty couldn’t do it on their own even if there were 2 people or3 . Especially if they don’t know how to strategize what to set  and utilizing the map. One thing is to do revision and salesplaners. And totally different for a transition when the department definitely needs support.


As a former plano Sr (a very good one, to toot my own horn), I can definitely confirm beauty is the absolute heaviest work you will do.  

I shaved hours in the preceding three weeks (one person/night) to bank for the beauty set and just scheduled a literal boatload of people.  Three per aisle side per night.  There's no other way to get it done effectively without just throwing shitloads of hours at it.  It's such a labor intensive set that any mis-step will shaft you.  I would rather suffer minimally for three weeks on easier workload and smash the beauty set than risk getting screwed on a bad night of beauty, because the amount of shifting that happens generally makes it so you have to do it in a specific order, or you end up with a huge mess.


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## balthrop (Jan 18, 2021)

Frontlanegirl said:


> Yes, there is a difference between a manager and a leader. You know the ones you want to work with are leaders.


and that would not be on single "leader" at my store nor the DTL, as for the Group dude he wears a suit and tie sorry m8 that's a no from me


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## Yetive (Jan 19, 2021)

At my store, Beauty team is setting Beauty.


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## seasonaldude (Jan 19, 2021)

Yetive said:


> At my store, Beauty team is setting Beauty.



Condolences for your year of wondering where in the hell is this location epick is sending you to.


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## vyrt (Jan 19, 2021)

I’m getting flak for them taking long when they’re doing it in the middle of the day fully stocked with people who have no clue how there fixtures work. And I tell them that target based this workload off the trays being stripped and the team working uninterrupted overnight.


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## vyrt (Jan 19, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> "Gm leadership around fulfillment or separating it into its own umbrella."
> What exactly do you mean by either of those things?


Additional fulfillment leadership. That’s been a. Given in the region recaps the vps sent out last week. And I’m sure come after February we’ll get a hardcore “here’s you’re fulfillment modernization don’t miss these metrics” rollout.


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## Far from newbie (Jan 19, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> where did you hear about it? planning on asking my ETL and TL about it tomorrow


Found a handout from a 2017/2018 Stores Modernization Roadmap
Looks like eliminating the flex team (after instocks, flow, Backroom, pricing and Plano teams) has been part of the plan for years - flex team will just be the last to go.
page 25 titled General Merchandise and Food Sales - describes The Mission of GM Team as “experts of operations, process and efficiency....GM experts own pick, pack and ship fulfillment work”. 
That may be why HR is bent on getting every DBO 100% on process and SD saying DBO’s can expect consistent 30-40 hours in the future - cause they will need it to get everything done.

And just lately - ALL TL - 
(Not ONLY the flex TL)
 are required to monitor flex numbers throughout the day.

Get ready for the next phase of modernization, 2021 edition.


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## Rarejem (Jan 19, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> And just lately - ALL TL -
> (Not ONLY the flex TL)
> are required to monitor flex numbers throughout the day.


Our tl's have been doing this somewhat all along, but consistently since the first of the year.


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## IcePeasant (Jan 19, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> And just lately - ALL TL -
> (Not ONLY the flex TL)
> are required to monitor flex numbers throughout the day.
> 
> Get ready for the next phase of modernization, 2021 edition.


LOL I did this when I came back from my run of construction projects- OD was hell bent on my stating leaders were following up not just my dedicated TL/myself. So when we leave at 2/3p, numbers consistently drop so made sense for handoff to another leader, but no. Oh and don’t get me started on the old school ways of keeping track of the team - whiteboard or binder, etc.


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## gsa4lyfe (Jan 19, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> Found a handout from a 2017/2018 Stores Modernization Roadmap
> Looks like eliminating the flex team (after instocks, flow, Backroom, pricing and Plano teams) has been part of the plan for years - flex team will just be the last to go.
> page 25 titled General Merchandise and Food Sales - describes The Mission of GM Team as “experts of operations, process and efficiency....GM experts own pick, pack and ship fulfillment work”.
> That may be why HR is bent on getting every DBO 100% on process and SD saying DBO’s can expect consistent 30-40 hours in the future - cause they will need it to get everything done.
> ...


This came out 2-3 years ago before fulfillment was the life line of our business. They’re starting to remodel stores this year to have capacity to have 15,000+ sqft of hold space and walk in coolers for GPU. We hit 2030 projections this year with drive up and order pick up. Fulfillment isn’t going anywhere


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## YugTegrat (Jan 19, 2021)

We used to think the same about the pricing and presentation teams. And instocks before them. It didn't make sense for Target to "get rid" of those teams either, but they did -- and we're still seeing the consequences of such decisions.

On paper, having every DBO be responsible for helping clear the daily fulfillment workload is easier to work with and much more flexible than trying to accurately distribute payroll based on forecasts that are usually wrong. In pretty much every store in the chain, I can guarantee that Flex Experts are either overwhelmed and need to be bailed out by other areas anyway *or* underwhelmed and helping other areas come clean. If it's impossible to hit that sweet spot, why not fold fulfillment into GM and be able to scale up your potential workforce to meet an ever-changing workload?

Again, makes sense on paper. But when GM can't come clean as it is, adding more to their plate just means something else won't be getting done instead.



Far from newbie said:


> That may be why HR is bent on getting every DBO 100% on process and SD saying DBO’s can expect consistent 30-40 hours in the future - cause they will need it to get everything done.


I'm also hesitant about such things. Anyone remember the questionnaire we received before Q4, asking us if we'd like to work 50 hours each week? And the video by someone in the upper echelons of Target leadership saying that the priority last year would be giving existing TMs overtime instead of just hiring more seasonals?

Yeah, we got two weeks of overtime at my store during Q4. That's it.


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## Rastaman (Jan 19, 2021)

Sweet baby Jesus.  We're already asking the DBO to do 8 hrs worth of work in a 5 hour shift.  Now we're going to ask them to pick orders too?

At least once/day now,  I have to resist the urge to curl up in the fetal position and weep like a little girl.


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## SigningLady (Jan 19, 2021)

As a former pog TM and signing ninja, I can tell you what happens to these experts when they are deemed unnecessary on paper: they get placed elsewhere and then get pulled right back in to fix whatever it is that they make look so easy to accomplish. I'm a DBO now and I haven't been in my own areas for 3+ weeks now because I am setting pog transitions.

Stores are great(ish) at making it look good on paper, and they can even fake it out in practice on occasion when people are looking, but realistically, they revert back to what actually works.


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## Far from newbie (Jan 19, 2021)

Don’t attack me for this but I really see the benefits of the DBO IDEA.  End to end, soup to nuts, all process ownership - what is new, what is marked down, what we have too much of, what we are out of -  what sells, what doesn’t.  things you know cause you see it everyday.  

My greatest challenge with it is TURNOVER !  I am CONSTANTLY training someone cause there are SO MANY things to learn !
 then, when they are 75% on process And light can be seen at the end of this training tunnel, the day is sooo close when they will be independent....they quit. 
   Now Start from the beginning with yet another newbie,  Rinse and repeat.  I oversee 7 DBO’s - only 1 is ALMOST Independent- all others have gaps in training, ability, will, drive, and knowledge to be independent.  One won’t backup cashier, another won’t answer the phone, only 2 can set a SPL, many leave vehicles and trash on the salesfloor,  most will not go to guest service for reshop, few complete back stock, all ignore price change, all leave push Undone.

I’m tired of “I don’t care” .   Few responsible adults want to work retail.


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## Frontlanegirl (Jan 19, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> Found a handout from a 2017/2018 Stores Modernization Roadmap
> Looks like eliminating the flex team (after instocks, flow, Backroom, pricing and Plano teams) has been part of the plan for years - flex team will just be the last to go.
> page 25 titled General Merchandise and Food Sales - describes The Mission of GM Team as “experts of operations, process and efficiency....GM experts own pick, pack and ship fulfillment work”.
> That may be why HR is bent on getting every DBO 100% on process and SD saying DBO’s can expect consistent 30-40 hours in the future - cause they will need it to get everything done.
> ...


So what happens if we don’t have a DBO for a certain area of the store...who picks those orders? What happens if they call out , vacation, left for the day or are not on the schedule that day?


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## Far from newbie (Jan 19, 2021)

keep in mind - change is slow.
- you continue all fulfillment work for one part of the store while you are learning many other things.
slowly you add the other stuff in between picking and some day you can ‘do it all” too.

changes to the schedule will happen to
dbo in every area every day -
 time off/call-outs will need to be covered just like we do now by rearranging people or making the TL cover.


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## Rastaman (Jan 19, 2021)

Target doesn't want full time team members.  Started trimming shifts a couple of years ago to cut average hours so they don't have to give benefits.  More money for the shareholders.


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## RTCry (Jan 19, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> Don’t attack me for this but I really see the benefits of the DBO IDEA.  End to end, soup to nuts, all process ownership - what is new, what is marked down, what we have too much of, what we are out of -  what sells, what doesn’t.  things you know cause you see it everyday.
> 
> My greatest challenge with it is TURNOVER !  I am CONSTANTLY training someone cause there are SO MANY things to learn !
> then, when they are 75% on process And light can be seen at the end of this training tunnel, the day is sooo close when they will be independent....they quit.
> ...


I like it too. It just doesn’t work when “DBOs” are given 15-20 hours a week. Target needs to step up with the payroll to facilitate their vision.


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## allnew2 (Jan 19, 2021)

Plano Tl is coming back.


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## Frontlanegirl (Jan 19, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> keep in mind - change is slow.
> - you continue all fulfillment work for one part of the store while you are learning many other things.
> slowly you add the other stuff in between picking and some day you can ‘do it all” too.
> 
> ...


Just looking at the DBO’s for my store, I don’t see this happening. We don’t have DBO’s for every area of the store. Most of our DBO’s are gone around noon and a lot of the OPU’s pick up in the afternoon. Here is another issue, when we have a double truck and they are pushing their entire shift, how will they pick orders. We have times where we have 10 people picking and that would be all of our DBO’s.


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## SigningLady (Jan 20, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Plano Tl is coming back.




For real!!?! I want details if you got 'em. In a PM if you don't want it public.


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## commiecorvus (Jan 20, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Plano Tl is coming back.



That wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.


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## allnew2 (Jan 20, 2021)

SigningLady said:


> For real!!?! I want details if you got 'em. In a PM if you don't want it public.


Store over 65mil are getting a Plano tl and team back , it will be a signing specialist which is in charge of ordering parts and all  , a PPA team member I  think it’s called it’s a team member that does all sfq, audits  walks transitions and puts in a tablet . That’s as far as I know for now . We are starting it in about 2 months


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## SigningLady (Jan 20, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Store over 65mil are getting a Plano tl and team back , it will be a signing specialist which is in charge of ordering parts and all  , a PPA team member I  think it’s called it’s a team member that does all sfq, audits  walks transitions and puts in a tablet . That’s as far as I know for now . We are starting it in about 2 months



Damn. My store is only around $30mil/year so we won't get the position. That's the one TL position I'd be willing to consider taking since that's basically the job I do when they schedule me in Plano.


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## SuperTarget (Jan 20, 2021)

I totally see the Presentation Team making a come back soon. The way they have been leveraging the Presentation Team as of late kinda shows they understand it’s still a needed team. However Presentation workload for transitions can vary from being almost nothing one week to a full 270 hour set the next week so you have to constantly grow and shrink the number of TMs you put on the Plano Team.

The way my store has been doing it has been working pretty well. We have 6 team members total that know POGs very well and are the ones that are used when a Plano team is needed for a big set. However those same team members are actually Fulfillment Experts in the system and are used for Fulfillment unless there is a large set in need of a Plano team. In my opinion it’s good because you leave DBOs to do their thing and Fulfillment can pretty much pull any extra person when OPUs get heavy.

I’m on Presentation this week with 5 other Plano TMs assisting the Beauty team with their transition while they just focus on pulls, push, and helping guests. Plano Team is focused only on the set. There is no way in hell that the Beauty Team could do this set while also keeping up on DBO routines. The Beauty Transition is a huge amount of work.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Jan 20, 2021)

SigningLady said:


> As a former pog TM and signing ninja, I can tell you what happens to these experts when they are deemed unnecessary on paper: they get placed elsewhere and then get pulled right back in to fix whatever it is that they make look so easy to accomplish. I'm a DBO now and I haven't been in my own areas for 3+ weeks now because I am setting pog transitions.
> 
> Stores are great(ish) at making it look good on paper, and they can even fake it out in practice on occasion when people are looking, but realistically, they revert back to what actually works.


I had a big fit last year when they were pulling me to set pogs and didn’t put anyone in my area. I was setting pogs in someone else’s dept with no help. The dbo of the area wasn’t even helping. They haven’t scheduled me to help pog at all this month. Lol. Made me a little nervous until I watched the dept not get toys done in 2 weeks and all the signing is still in the fixture room.


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## gsa4lyfe (Jan 20, 2021)

SuperTarget said:


> I totally see the Presentation Team making a come back soon. The way they have been leveraging the Presentation Team as of late kinda shows they understand it’s still a needed team. However Presentation workload for transitions can vary from being almost nothing one week to a full 270 hour set the next week so you have to constantly grow and shrink the number of TMs you put on the Plano Team.
> 
> The way my store has been doing it has been working pretty well. We have 6 team members total that know POGs very well and are the ones that are used when a Plano team is needed for a big set. However those same team members are actually Fulfillment Experts in the system and are used for Fulfillment unless there is a large set in need of a Plano team. In my opinion it’s good because you leave DBOs to do their thing and Fulfillment can pretty much pull any extra person when OPUs get heavy.
> 
> I’m on Presentation this week with 5 other Plano TMs assisting the Beauty team with their transition while they just focus on pulls, push, and helping guests. Plano Team is focused only on the set. There is no way in hell that the Beauty Team could do this set while also keeping up on DBO routines. The Beauty Transition is a huge amount of work.


There’s plans to spread out sets and have less adjacency moves in order to average out the weeks in order to maintain an actual Plano team. All these “map-its” have been huge adjacency changes this past year in order to get a more sustainable map. Most big sets will be spread out to her 2 weeks instead of 1 week. They’re starting it out with the outdoor living set this year. In the past they’ve given you 2 weeks to complete but the hours are all in one week. The plan is to actually have it due in 2 separate weeks and split the payroll


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## Boxman (Jan 20, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Store over 65mil are getting a Plano tl and team back , it will be a signing specialist which is in charge of ordering parts and all  , a PPA team member I  think it’s called it’s a team member that does all sfq, audits  walks transitions and puts in a tablet . That’s as far as I know for now . We are starting it in about 2 months


I'm not complaining about this.  

LOL, the back-treading of Modernization has already begun, yet at the same time there are rumors of getting rid of Fulfillment?  If this doesn't SCREAM typical Spot I don't know what does.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Jan 20, 2021)

Well shoot. My store is at about 60 Mil.


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## Far from newbie (Jan 20, 2021)

allnew2 said:


> Plano Tl is coming back.


BACK ?  I NEVER left !  True, TEAM has shrunk and no signing person but we do all transitions and revisions.  Only 2-3 on actual team but larger sets get anyone’s help to de-merch, pull batches and push product.


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## Frontlanegirl (Jan 20, 2021)

Well, I heard some comments today that our fulfillment “team” will be minimized within the next few weeks. Not sure how this will work.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Jan 20, 2021)

Frontlanegirl said:


> Well, I heard some comments today that our fulfillment “team” will be minimized within the next few weeks. Not sure how this will work.


More work & less tm's. Backup from style & gm. Then, no backup when everyone is on register.


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## Rarejem (Jan 23, 2021)

Far from newbie said:


> Don’t attack me for this but I really see the benefits of the DBO IDEA.  End to end, soup to nuts, all process ownership - what is new, what is marked down, what we have too much of, what we are out of -  what sells, what doesn’t.  things you know cause you see it everyday.


Just to be clear, owning the process does not necessarily entail owning the workload.  Modernization calls out GM experts, not DBO. I think the DBO should work with the TL to ensure that the work is completed, but it would be really great to have a GM expert available to work freight/pulls while the DBO oversees the department in the same way that an ETL oversees TL and TL currently oversees TM's.  Consolidation of TL's would be possible and the "grunt work" could be completed without interruptions if the DBO had the opportunity to do everything else. (Yes, I know this is a flashback to having an actual flow team, but it actually worked most of the time.  GM experts today, as opposed to most flow tm's, (should) have more knowledge of the processes and how they work together, so more of an investment in time and accuracy.


----------



## MxTarget (Jan 23, 2021)

Rarejem said:


> Just to be clear, owning the process does not necessarily entail owning the workload.  Modernization calls out GM experts, not DBO. I think the DBO should work with the TL to ensure that the work is completed, but it would be really great to have a GM expert available to work freight/pulls while the DBO oversees the department in the same way that an ETL oversees TL and TL currently oversees TM's.  Consolidation of TL's would be possible and the "grunt work" could be completed without interruptions if the DBO had the opportunity to do everything else. (Yes, I know this is a flashback to having an actual flow team, but it actually worked most of the time.  GM experts today, as opposed to most flow tm's, (should) have more knowledge of the processes and how they work together, so more of an investment in time and accuracy.



Honestly, I feel the accountability line is very frustrating.  Shouldn’t flex just be more accountable and pick/pack faster?  It’s such an easy solution.  Yes, of course there are bad DBOs.  DBOs who don’t give a heck about their area, but honestly I think they’re in the minority.  A lot of DBOs who came in post-modernization, haven’t been given a lot of skills.  You could blame leadership, but dang, half of them haven’t been trained correctly either.  That’s what you get in this trial by fire culture, which has so many moving parts at the sole responsibility of usually one person an area.  Except that at a moments notice, we’re also expected to surge support flex and the front-end instantly when our days are already packed. 

How are you suppose to recover that time?  Most of my days are trying to squeeze 12hrs of work into 8, just to get clean and it’s so fragile that even picking one OPU can mean something gonna be left behind.  If these changes are true, i don’t see fulfillment as going away but becoming everyone’s core tasks with everything is being designed to revolve around fulfillment.  And fulfillment teams would learn just as much and probably increase pick time/reduce infs, if they had more sales floor operational knowledge.  

Honestly, after this year if you’re a DBO you probably just feel like a flex tm who moonlights in some department. Lol


----------



## jenna (Jan 23, 2021)

Rarejem said:


> Just to be clear, owning the process does not necessarily entail owning the workload.  Modernization calls out GM experts, not DBO. I think the DBO should work with the TL to ensure that the work is completed, but it would be really great to have a GM expert available to work freight/pulls while the DBO oversees the department in the same way that an ETL oversees TL and TL currently oversees TM's.  Consolidation of TL's would be possible and the "grunt work" could be completed without interruptions if the DBO had the opportunity to do everything else. (Yes, I know this is a flashback to having an actual flow team, but it actually worked most of the time.  GM experts today, as opposed to most flow tm's, (should) have more knowledge of the processes and how they work together, so more of an investment in time and accuracy.



Uh,  no offense, but I don't want the *flow team* working in my area.  I saw how 4th quarter went - with flow over night.  As a TL, I would spend a shit-ton of time pulling off over-stock, mis-stock, etc... each week.


----------



## Rarejem (Jan 23, 2021)

jenna said:


> Uh,  no offense, but I don't want the *flow team* working in my area.  I saw how 4th quarter went - with flow over night.  As a TL, I would spend a shit-ton of time pulling off over-stock, mis-stock, etc... each week.


Understood, but that's not what I'm saying. Having someone other than DOB push the truck is my point and GM experts are not the same as flow team, but would take on that part of the GM responsibility (which is the throwback part), freeing up the DOB to actually complete other tasks in a timely way. Because the DOB would still be responsible for pulls, SFQ, etc. this would not/should not affect the TL if the DOB is given the actual time to do these things.  No offense, but if it does, the TL should be training/coaching the DOB.  TL's should be spending their time managing and leading their team, not doing their work.


----------



## jenna (Jan 23, 2021)

Rarejem said:


> Understood, but that's not what I'm saying. Having someone other than DOB push the truck is my point and GM experts are not the same as flow team, but would take on that part of the GM responsibility (which is the throwback part), freeing up the DOB to actually complete other tasks in a timely way. Because the DOB would still be responsible for pulls, SFQ, etc. this would not/should not affect the TL if the DOB is given the actual time to do these things.  No offense, but if it does, the TL should be training/coaching the DOB.  TL's should be spending their time managing and leading their team, not doing their work.



At my store, I think I trust maybe two people to push my freight correctly.

Everyone else fucks shit up.


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## Rarejem (Jan 23, 2021)

jenna said:


> At my store, I think I trust maybe two people to push my freight correctly.
> 
> Everyone else fucks shit up.


Why are the rest of them still there?????


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## jenna (Jan 23, 2021)

Rarejem said:


> Why are the rest of them still there?????


warm bodies?

: shrug :


----------



## BurgerBob (Jan 24, 2021)

The toy dbo tells me when they have a busy day. ,which is code for " I'll cover your breaks  and lunch just so I don't have to backup  the front end. "


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## MrT (Jan 24, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> So, has anybody heard any updates in the past few weeks?


Nope every schedule weve made has been same old, same old.  Its possible that this is something being piloted by your area i suppose though.


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## Jayunderscore (Jan 24, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> So, has anybody heard any updates in the past few weeks?


I asked and was told our store was too high volume to ever even consider this.


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## seasonaldude (Jan 24, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> how many units is busy for you? our maximum in Q4 was ~2200 in ship (early December) and something like 2500(iirc) in OPU on christmas eve. highest combined was probably under 3000
> Standard format store.



Shit. Can I transfer to your store? We did 4000+ in OPU everyday in December. We're still at 2-3000 a day now. We don't have SFS and we're a low volume store overall. OPU is 15% of store sales. I'm drowning over here.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Jan 24, 2021)

ahhd4mn said:


> how many units is busy for you? our maximum in Q4 was ~2200 in ship (early December) and something like 2500(iirc) in OPU on christmas eve. highest combined was probably under 3000
> Standard format store.


Lmao. We did 8000-10,000 a day in December.


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## moninity (Jan 24, 2021)

We are at least a week behind in trucks because of how bad opu has been. I left at 330 and we were closing in on 2000 and I was the only one doing SFS and I was constantly being pulled away to help with opu. Todays orders was only 150 items for ship I managed to pick everything with a pick productivity of 60 which would of been higher if I wasn't constantly pausing to help out opu. Unfortunately  I had to leave 2 carts to be packed before 430 and I don't think anyone got to it. We constantly had 6+ people doing opu and we couldn't keep up. The grocery team lead told me that there was going to be a meeting tomorrow to talk about what's going on since they are constantly taking pfresh team members and they are behind in trucks to where there is no more room left for incoming pallets to be staged. No way in hell can the store survive by getting rid of fulfillment team members.


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## MrT (Jan 24, 2021)

We did up to 4k in ship a d about 4k a day in opu.  Now we still do about 1k ship and 2k opu atleast but with like 1/4th the hours it can be brutal with even just one call out


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## Bosch (Jan 25, 2021)

MrT said:


> We did up to 4k in ship a d about 4k a day in opu.  Now we still do about 1k ship and 2k opu atleast but with like 1/4th the hours it can be brutal with even just one call out



and heaven forbid you INF anything in the piles of freight not pushed or backstocked. I know this time of year is bad but why is every year worse than the last.


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## Jayunderscore (Jan 25, 2021)

It varies from quarter to quarter but right now we’re sitting at around 2-2.5k in OPU a day and average 1-1.2k in SFS a day.


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