# Losing my patience.



## CartoonPenguin (Feb 23, 2022)

I'm a GM Team Member who's in development to become a GMTL. More specifically, the hardlines GMTL who oversees toys, entertainment, sporting goods, and seasonal. Almost a month ago, my HR ETL had me fill out this worksheet detailing my development plan and it had a bunch of goals and metrics to meet. The plan is to basically have me overseeing this hardlines section of the store, ensuring all of my one-for-ones are pulled at 100% every day, coming clean on price change, set workload, etc. I've only been going at this for a few weeks, but I just want to know when I can expect things to get going in terms of an interview and actual promotion.

I've always suffered from FOMO and it's getting to me now. I see all of these TL's in their meetings and whatnot and I can't help but want to be a part of that. I've been at Target for a while and I feel like it's well past time that I start to grow and develop. Can any other TL's possibly give me some insight? Because I'm really starting to lose my patience.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Feb 23, 2022)

A question about TL development.
					

A few weeks ago, I talked with my GM ETL about leadership positions. We chatted and she brough up additonal "developmental activities" around the store to help me as I stay in the pipeline and unofficially train to be a leader. This included being the Seasonal DBO, which is easy so far. Our...




					www.thebreakroom.org
				



Take note from the other threads.


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## Planosss enraged (Feb 23, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> I'm a GM Team Member who's in development to become a GMTL. More specifically, the hardlines GMTL who oversees toys, entertainment, sporting goods, and seasonal. Almost a month ago, my HR ETL had me fill out this worksheet detailing my development plan and it had a bunch of goals and metrics to meet. The plan is to basically have me overseeing this hardlines section of the store, ensuring all of my one-for-ones are pulled at 100% every day, coming clean on price change, set workload, etc. I've only been going at this for a few weeks, but I just want to know when I can expect things to get going in terms of an interview and actual promotion.
> 
> I've always suffered from FOMO and it's getting to me now. I see all of these TL's in their meetings and whatnot and I can't help but want to be a part of that. I've been at Target for a while and I feel like it's well past time that I start to grow and develop. Can any other TL's possibly give me some insight? Because I'm really starting to lose my patience.


You can ask to be part of the TL meetings. You are a pretend a TL anyways, might as well pretend like one in meetings 🤷🏻‍♂️


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## Xanatos (Feb 23, 2022)

So... they're making you a DBO? This doesn't sound like TL development.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 23, 2022)

Xanatos said:


> So... they're making you a DBO? This doesn't sound like TL development.


I’m still a DBO, but they keep saying that I’m overseeing all of the hardlines section the store. They’ve given me some opportunities to lead other TM’s who also work in those areas.


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## Xanatos (Feb 23, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> I’m still a DBO, but they keep saying that I’m overseeing all of the hardlines section the store. They’ve given me some opportunities to lead other TM’s who also work in those areas.


Ok good, that makes more sense. That's the only way you'll really be able to show your leadership skills.

Regardless, I look forward to the advice you get in this thread.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 23, 2022)

Hardlinesmaster said:


> A question about TL development.
> 
> 
> A few weeks ago, I talked with my GM ETL about leadership positions. We chatted and she brough up additonal "developmental activities" around the store to help me as I stay in the pipeline and unofficially train to be a leader. This included being the Seasonal DBO, which is easy so far. Our...
> ...


That thread might be a moot point since my GM ETL just up and quit without notice and it’s now clear that she was never serious about my development.

My SD and HR ETL have sat down and had some chats with me and they appear to have outlined a more detailed plan for me.


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## Jayunderscore (Feb 23, 2022)

OFO completion, price change completion, and set workload completion all sound like ways to show that you've made a positive impact in the store during your development. These completion percentages will be one of the keys to your interview process. I use a similar plan with my team members who are in development. Remember to continually follow up with your leads on how things are going, because ultimately your development is  your responsibility.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 23, 2022)

Jayunderscore said:


> OFO completion, price change completion, and set workload completion all sound like ways to show that you've made a positive impact in the store during your development. These completion percentages will be one of the keys to your interview process. I use a similar plan with my team members who are in development. Remember to continually follow up with your leads on how things are going, because ultimately your development is  your responsibility.



When can I expect the SD to actually get me set for an interview? Because the hardlines GMTL spot at my store is open after the prior leader left just a couple of weeks ago and I obviously want to fill it.

Is there a certain metric or goal that I have to meet? Is there a certain time of year that interviews and promotions are done? Or is it just whenever the SD decides?


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## Jayunderscore (Feb 23, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> When can I expect the SD to actually get me set for an interview? Because the hardlines GMTL spot at my store is open after the prior leader left just a couple of weeks ago and I obviously want to fill it.
> 
> Is there a certain metric or goal that I have to meet? Is there a certain time of year that interviews and promotions are done? Or is it just whenever the SD decides?


I'd say it's mostly up to your SD's discretion but sometimes there are outside factors. I know right now our HRD and BPs are saying there is a promotion freeze until after headcounts and reviews are finalized except for extraneous factors so no movement in my group right now unless approved.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Feb 23, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> That thread might be a moot point since my GM ETL just up and quit without notice and it’s now clear that she was never serious about my development.
> 
> My SD and HR ETL have sat down and had some chats with me and they appear to have outlined a more detailed plan for me.


You might want to review your prior threads. They do have tips to help you. Throwing a zebra, is a minus.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Feb 23, 2022)

I’m amazed he’s still asking for advice.


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## IhateOPmodel (Feb 23, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> When can I expect the SD to actually get me set for an interview? Because the hardlines GMTL spot at my store is open after the prior leader left just a couple of weeks ago and I obviously want to fill it.
> 
> Is there a certain metric or goal that I have to meet? Is there a certain time of year that interviews and promotions are done? Or is it just whenever the SD decides?


Well it depends on if there are openings and if you are willing to move stores or want to stay at your store.  Be patient, it isn't going to happen over night.  With your previous temper tantrums they are likely testing you and seeing if you can handle the stress etc.  In my district they are extremely desperate for ETLs and they are promoting a ton fron within and it has created a ton of openings for TL.

If I were you I'd ask for feedback from your TL about your performance and take them seriously and try to improve. Also you can ask your SD if they could sit down with you and go over talking points and interview prep when the time gets closer.

Overall my biggest recommendation for you is to be patient and relax.  This will not happen in a few weeks or probably months especially given your history.  Work hard through it all and show you can handle anything thrown your way and always be the first to volunteer to help out in other areas.


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## seasonaldude (Feb 23, 2022)

IhateOPmodel said:


> show you can handle anything thrown your way



I see what you did there...


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## Hope4Future (Feb 23, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> I've always suffered from FOMO and it's getting to me now. I see all of these TL's in their meetings and whatnot and I can't help but want to be a part of that. I've been at Target for a while and I feel like it's well past time that I start to grow and develop. Can any other TL's possibly give me some insight? Because I'm really starting to lose my patience.


Are you sure that you are in this for the right reasons? It seems like you want to become a TL only for the exclusivity of being in meetings and you're not thinking about the stress and how demanding the work can be.


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## happygoth (Feb 24, 2022)

The gift that keeps on giving...


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## Hal (Feb 24, 2022)

Do you have to interview for the position of Team Lead? Or do you just get promoted to the role? Coming DC side 99.9% of promotions and moves that aren't just department/shift require an interview.


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## lucidtm (Feb 24, 2022)

Hal said:


> Do you have to interview for the position of Team Lead? Or do you just get promoted to the role? Coming DC side 99.9% of promotions and moves that aren't just department/shift require an interview.


From what I've seen, you do interview and sometimes it can take awhile for the position to fill. However regardless of the interviews, 9 times out of 10 (with the 10th time being a Closing TL since no one seems to want that position) the store knows exactly who they want to put in the role before it even gets announced or listed on the site.


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## Far from newbie (Feb 24, 2022)

Don’t lose control : 
but I have to say -  if the position has been open ‘for weeks’ and you haven’t been offered it yet - then it isn’t happening.  

Leadership usually has plans in place in advance. If the position hasn’t been filled yet it means they don’t see anyone ‘in house’ that they want for the position.

Unless the reason IS ‘the freeze’ until reviews are over.  That is a possibility.  Or they could be waiting on an answer from someone else first - but I doubt they would have given them this long to think about it.

you COULD keep trying but really, it doesn’t look like it will happen.


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## IhateOPmodel (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> That thread might be a moot point since my GM ETL just up and quit without notice and it’s now clear that she was never serious about my development.
> 
> My SD and HR ETL have sat down and had some chats with me and they appear to have outlined a more detailed plan for me.


Is there even a position available at your store?


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

Far from newbie said:


> Don’t lose control :
> but I have to say -  if the position has been open ‘for weeks’ and you haven’t been offered it yet - then it isn’t happening.
> 
> Leadership usually has plans in place in advance. If the position hasn’t been filled yet it means they don’t see anyone ‘in house’ that they want for the position.
> ...



They haven’t specifically offered the actual promotion, but they’ve sat down with me and discussed me more or less taking up some of the responsibilities that the lead would oversee in said area, like a test run to see if I can handle it.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

IhateOPmodel said:


> Is there even a position available at your store?


Yeah, hardlines GMTL.


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## IhateOPmodel (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Yeah, hardlines GMTL.


Well did you ask if you could apply for it?  Usually that will force their hand.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

IhateOPmodel said:


> Well did you ask if you could apply for it?  Usually that will force their hand.


The position hasn’t been posted on Workday or the careers site. My HR ETL just had me fill out this worksheet detailing my development plan and then he told me that I just have to wait for my SD to sit down and discuss it with me, whenever that is.


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## Hal (Feb 24, 2022)

I'm going to ask a question that has been asked of you 1000 times in the 50+ threads/reddit posts and potentially give myself an aneurysm over your answer.

Why should they promote you?

And I don't mean this as a jerk. But honestly ask yourself why you deserve to be promoted. Think of it in terms of the interview. What skills do you bring to the table? What have you done that impacted your department metrics, your team or your store, besides throwing expensive equipment, that makes you deserve it over Joe Schmoe off the streets or Mary-Sue from softlines (Idk store departments).

And if your answer is "I'm a hard worker and I've been with Target for a long time." Congratulations, you're in the same bucket as the thousands of other team members that come up wanting a promotion.

Because right now from your motivations you've mentioned in other threads you've said "I wanna sleep with another TL," "I deserve it because I think I'm better than the girl they promoted last year cause I worked here longer," and "I wanna feel special by being in TL meetings." Not great.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

Hal said:


> I'm going to ask a question that has been asked of you 1000 times in the 50+ threads/reddit posts and potentially give myself an aneurysm over your answer.
> 
> Why should they promote you?
> 
> ...


Ok, I'm going to give you an honest answer and I want you to critique it and give your unfiltered thoughts.

Our store has a real problem on the sales floor with certain TM's who only do the bare minimum and never go above and beyond. They're perfectly content in just standing around and pushing freight, but they never support other parts of the store. A call for back up in E-pick or to the front lanes will go completely ignored by them and they won't offer any type of response. I know from personal experience that it can be extremely frustrating to feel like the only one in the store who's backing up and I'm going to be more firm and stringent on making sure that the team actually works as a team instead of just letting a small handful of TM's carry the load. This includes ensuring that every single TM is trained for other parts of the store and letting them know that certain conversations will be taking place if they don't offer their support.

Furthermore, the team needs to be taught about workplace integrity, something of which I'm a firm believer in. You clock in, you put in a hard day's work and do your job because that's what you're hired to do, you clock out, and it doesn't go further than that. Certain TM's will only do a certain task if they're promised with some type of reward (a drink from starbucks, getting lunch bought for them, etc) and that needs to stop. A large majority of people on the GM team are full grown adults and we need to stop infantilizing them with treats and goodies.

It's been far too long that certain unmotivated TM's behaviors have been enabled and I'm a potential TL who knows that that system needs to finally come to and end, so as to make sure that we become an actual team that actively supports the store together.


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## Rarejem (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, I'm going to give you an honest answer and I want you to critique it and give your unfiltered thoughts.
> 
> Our store has a real problem on the sales floor with certain TM's who only do the bare minimum and never go above and beyond. They're perfectly content in just standing around and pushing freight, but they never support other parts of the store. A call for back up in E-pick or to the front lanes will go completely ignored by them and they won't offer any type of response. I know from personal experience that it can be extremely frustrating to feel like the only one in the store who's backing up and I'm going to be more firm and stringent on making sure that the team actually works as a team instead of just letting a small handful of TM's carry the load. This includes ensuring that every single TM is trained for other parts of the store and letting them know that certain conversations will be taking place if they don't offer their support.
> 
> ...


My unfiltered and first reaction is that this sounds like it's more about wanting power or maybe even revenge than being a leader to me.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

Rarejem said:


> My unfiltered and first reaction is that this sounds like it's more about wanting power or maybe even revenge than being a leader to me.


I don’t care about getting revenge. I just want all of the team to start pitching in and not letting just one or two or the same people carry everyone’s load and constantly getting pulled from their work.

We’ve already had one GM team member lash out and quit because he was sick of being the only one to back up OPU and I honestly don’t see what’s so wrong with wanting to prevent something like that from happening in the future.


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## happygoth (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, I'm going to give you an honest answer and I want you to critique it and give your unfiltered thoughts.
> 
> Our store has a real problem on the sales floor with certain TM's who only do the bare minimum and never go above and beyond. They're perfectly content in just standing around and pushing freight, but they never support other parts of the store. A call for back up in E-pick or to the front lanes will go completely ignored by them and they won't offer any type of response. I know from personal experience that it can be extremely frustrating to feel like the only one in the store who's backing up and I'm going to be more firm and stringent on making sure that the team actually works as a team instead of just letting a small handful of TM's carry the load. This includes ensuring that every single TM is trained for other parts of the store and letting them know that certain conversations will be taking place if they don't offer their support.
> 
> ...


And how does all of that integrity jibe with you wanting to date TLs and TMs? Not downing workplace dating, hell I met my husband at my former job.  But I didn't seek a promotion mainly to try and get with him, lol. Which is what you claimed when you first started posting.

And I said this before and I will say it again : a TL trying to change store culture will go over like a lead balloon without full ETL/SD support. If they aren't making an issue out of it, it is not an issue. Yes it sucks, yes it's unfair, but every store has those TMs that skate by, or that just aren't part of the queue when it comes to helping out in other areas. Wanting to become a manager so that you can start dropping the hammer down - well,  good luck with that. They will use you to be the bad guy so that they can keep their hands clean and not incur any ill will.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

happygoth said:


> And how does all of that integrity jibe with you wanting to date TLs and TMs? Not downing workplace dating, hell I met my husband at my former job.  But I didn't seek a promotion mainly to try and get with him, lol. Which is what you claimed when you first started posting.
> 
> And I said this before and I will say it again : a TL trying to change store culture will go over like a lead balloon without full ETL/SD support. If they aren't making an issue out of it, it is not an issue. Yes it sucks, yes it's unfair, but every store has those TMs that skate by, or that just aren't part of the queue when it comes to helping out in other areas. Wanting to become a manager so that you can start dropping the hammer down - well,  good luck with that. They will use you to be the bad guy so that they can keep their hands clean and not incur any ill will.


I’m not trying to “change store culture”.

We have our cleaning supplies right next to the front of store. And you want to know how many times our cleaning supplies DBO has gone to back up the lanes? Zero. It’s literally 10 feet from her, yet she never backs up and we have instances of a toy DBO coming up all the way from the back of the store.

That’s not changing store culture, that’s just wanting certain team members to stop being so lazy.


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## happygoth (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> I’m not trying to “change store culture”.
> 
> We have our cleaning supplies right next to the front of store. And you want to know how many times our cleaning supplies DBO has gone to back up the lanes? Zero. It’s literally 10 feet from her, yet she never backs up and we have instances of a toy DBO coming up all the way from the back of the store.
> 
> That’s not changing store culture, that’s just wanting certain team members to stop being so lazy.


But if no one else is holding them accountable, what makes you think that if you become a TL, you will be able to change that?

ETA: In fact, I will bet that if you became TL you wouldn't want your people backing up because that pulls them from the floor and takes them away from getting their work done, which causes more problems for you. And if you are talking about TMs that aren't under your direct supervision, well that will just cause resentment amongst both the TMs and their supervisors.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

happygoth said:


> But if no one else is holding them accountable, what makes you think that if you become a TL, you will be able to change that?


Because our essentials GMTL was an internal promotion who's close friends with our cleaning supplies DBO. They hung out together all the time before her promotion and I wouldn't be surprised if they're still secretly hanging out. I can guarantee that the essentials TL is just afraid of ruffling feathers and jeopardizing their friendship. I have no such conflicts of interest going on with any other GM Team members.


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## Rarejem (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> I don’t care about getting revenge. I just want all of the team to start pitching in and not letting just one or two or the same people carry everyone’s load and constantly getting pulled from their work.
> 
> We’ve already had one GM team member lash out and quit because he was sick of being the only one to back up OPU and I honestly don’t see what’s so wrong with wanting to prevent something like that from happening in the future.


Take the team you work with out of the picture and ask yourself "What about me makes me a good leader?" "How do I develop a great team that respects one another and their leaders?" Put your current team back into the picture and ask yourself "Do I have a positive attitude about my job and coworkers? Do others perceive it?" "Am I developing positive work relations with others, regardless of my personal feelings toward them?"


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## Hal (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, I'm going to give you an honest answer and I want you to critique it and give your unfiltered thoughts.
> 
> Our store has a real problem on the sales floor with certain TM's who only do the bare minimum and never go above and beyond. They're perfectly content in just standing around and pushing freight, but they never support other parts of the store. A call for back up in E-pick or to the front lanes will go completely ignored by them and they won't offer any type of response. I know from personal experience that it can be extremely frustrating to feel like the only one in the store who's backing up and I'm going to be more firm and stringent on making sure that the team actually works as a team instead of just letting a small handful of TM's carry the load. This includes ensuring that every single TM is trained for other parts of the store and letting them know that certain conversations will be taking place if they don't offer their support.
> 
> ...


Okay. So all you've done is tell me that you are an expert at finding problems.

Managers don't want problem finders, they want problem solvers. Find out the whys and then go figure out how to fix it.

Go have some conversations with those team members. Politely ask them why they are struggling. Maybe it is laziness, or maybe there's a legit reasons why they're missing on their tasks.

Why is cleaning supplies dbo not backing up lanes? Maybe there's more going on that you're not aware of and maybe its something that YOU can help fix now. Constantly ask  why and do it with a sense of curiousity not interrogation.

Once your leaders see you're someone who works with people to try and solve problems they're going to be much more likely to want to promote you. Not only that the team starts to buy into you as a leader which if you move into role makes that transition easier.


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## happygoth (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Because our essentials GMTL was an internal promotion who's close friends with our cleaning supplies DBO. They hung out together all the time before her promotion and I wouldn't be surprised if they're still secretly hanging out. I can guarantee that the essentials TL is just afraid of ruffling feathers and jeopardizing their friendship. I have no such conflicts of interest going on with any other GM Team members.


Let me ask you this: what answers are you hoping to get by asking these questions here? Has anyone given you advice that you agree with or that has been helpful? What is your motivation?


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## happygoth (Feb 24, 2022)

Hal said:


> Okay. So all you've done is tell me that you are an expert at finding problems.
> 
> Managers don't want problem finders, they want problem solvers. Find out the whys and then go figure out how to fix it.
> 
> ...


I've said it before and I'll say it again: a regular TM, regardless of what kind of power they may think they have, asking questions and trying to lead other TMs is not a good look. You will get push back, you will breed resentment. Unless a leader tells everyone else on the team that this person has the authority, people will be looking at them like "Who the hell are you? Handle your own business."


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## Rarejem (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Because our essentials GMTL was an internal promotion who's close friends with our cleaning supplies DBO. They hung out together all the time before her promotion and I wouldn't be surprised if they're still secretly hanging out. I can guarantee that the essentials TL is just afraid of ruffling feathers and jeopardizing their friendship. I have no such conflicts of interest going on with any other GM Team members.


_And then I didn't get asked to the prom!! It's just not fair!!!  _You were right about needing to work on your FOMO.


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## lucidtm (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, I'm going to give you an honest answer and I want you to critique it and give your unfiltered thoughts.
> 
> *Our store has a real problem on the sales floor with certain TM's who only do the bare minimum and never go above and beyond. They're perfectly content in just standing around and pushing freight, but they never support other parts of the store. A call for back up in E-pick or to the front lanes will go completely ignored by them and they won't offer any type of response. *I know from personal experience that it can be extremely frustrating to feel like the only one in the store who's backing up and I'm going to be more firm and stringent on making sure that the team actually works as a team instead of just letting a small handful of TM's carry the load. This includes ensuring that every single TM is trained for other parts of the store and letting them know that certain conversations will be taking place if they don't offer their support.
> 
> ...



This is true for all stores. It is what it is, especially when there are younger employees on your roster. For some, this is their first job. 

The best you can do is pick your battles in terms of what you want to coach them on and document everything. If the coachings add up to a warranted CA you can get with your ETL in GM or HR and if they're in agreement then draft it. Keep in mind, it takes a lot of coachings to get to the CA and even then it's not like these employees are going to be out the door immediately. 

Coming from someone that does bust their butt at work and always has; I get what you're saying about wanting that change. The smart way to start to make that change is by observing behaviors and trying to amend them without seeming like you're being intrusive or stepping out of your place. You can be helpful without coming across as rude or demanding. Going in with "guns blazing" is just going to make you a bunch enemies. And if these kids don't respect you in _any _way, they're not going to do a damn thing for you. 

Based off of what you said above, the way it would come across to me in the hiring process is someone who would be good at getting the job done, but not someone good at leading a team of people that need guided and, for lack of a better word, babysat. You can't run your department like a dictator and expect positive results. If I were your ETL I wouldn't hire you because I wouldn't want to have to deal with the fallout and stress because of your behavior.


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## IhateOPmodel (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, I'm going to give you an honest answer and I want you to critique it and give your unfiltered thoughts.
> 
> Our store has a real problem on the sales floor with certain TM's who only do the bare minimum and never go above and beyond. They're perfectly content in just standing around and pushing freight, but they never support other parts of the store. A call for back up in E-pick or to the front lanes will go completely ignored by them and they won't offer any type of response. I know from personal experience that it can be extremely frustrating to feel like the only one in the store who's backing up and I'm going to be more firm and stringent on making sure that the team actually works as a team instead of just letting a small handful of TM's carry the load. This includes ensuring that every single TM is trained for other parts of the store and letting them know that certain conversations will be taking place if they don't offer their support.
> 
> ...


Talk about positives, don't use your time to put down what your peers are doing.  I'd suggest just saying what you've done and the impact you've had since they've been giving you added responsibility.  Talk about your relationships with the team and how you are a go to person for questions and training opportunities from your peers.

DO NOT talk about what you see are problems or things the team is lacking. Make everything a positive and how you POSITIVELY impact the store on a daily basis.

For example don't talk about the team being content and standing around and not doing anything.  Say how you like to lead by example and go above and beyond and hope that will gain the buy in and respect from the team and insipire them to do the same.

Like others have said it seems like you are in this for the wrong reasons and it also seems like you are on a power trip.  Just some the of the words you use in your post leads me to believe this.  If you were to use the term "full grown adults" and "infantilizing" in an interview with me, I'd write you off right then and there.

I've learned long ago that the team is more responsive to a leader they like, respect and can relate to than someone who is a hard ass or disciplinarian.  I've had team members who were awful while working under other TL, but once they came and worked for me they were top performers.


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## smarthuddle (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Because our essentials GMTL was an internal promotion who's close friends with our cleaning supplies DBO. They hung out together all the time before her promotion and I wouldn't be surprised if they're still secretly hanging out. I can guarantee that the essentials TL is just afraid of ruffling feathers and jeopardizing their friendship. I have no such conflicts of interest going on with any other GM Team members.


How much more freight is the cleaning supplies DBO getting than the toys DBO. There are so many different factors that make it seem like others are lazy when they aren’t. For instance, in my store, Style supports the front lanes & GM supports OPU. Covid is still a thing and cleaning supplies in general are a day to day. Toys isn’t always busy and the freight isn’t heavy unless it’s a transition or Q4.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

smarthuddle said:


> How much more freight is the cleaning supplies DBO getting than the toys DBO. There are so many different factors that make it seem like others are lazy when they aren’t. For instance, in my store, Style supports the front lanes & GM supports OPU. Covid is still a thing and cleaning supplies in general are a day to day. Toys isn’t always busy and the freight isn’t heavy unless it’s a transition or Q4.


I honestly think that chem and toys are near equal in terms of freight at our store. We’re fairly low volume.

I still don’t think it’s the end of the world if the chem DBO has to walk ten feet just to back up at the lanes for what’s realistically going to be no more than a few minutes.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

IhateOPmodel said:


> Talk about positives, don't use your time to put down what your peers are doing.  I'd suggest just saying what you've done and the impact you've had since they've been giving you added responsibility.  Talk about your relationships with the team and how you are a go to person for questions and training opportunities from your peers.
> 
> DO NOT talk about what you see are problems or things the team is lacking. Make everything a positive and how you POSITIVELY impact the store on a daily basis.
> 
> ...



Ok, how about I bring up my experience and tenure?

For example, I could bring up personal experience in feeling unsure and even afraid of approaching certain leaders. I’d want to let the team know that my door is always open and that I genuinely want to help them and take their questions and concerns with no judgement.


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## Black Sheep 214 (Feb 24, 2022)

A TL giving orders to or trying to discipline another TL’s TMs is like slapping somebody else’s kid. Doesn’t go over well, and tends to bring out the mother/father bear in the affected TL. If a TM in another department is slacking or worse, tell their TL and let them handle it as they see fit. The last thing a new TL needs is to alienate their TL peers and cause drama for the store.


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## happygoth (Feb 24, 2022)

Black Sheep 214 said:


> A TL giving orders to or trying to discipline another TL’s TMs is like slapping somebody else’s kid. Doesn’t go over well, and tends to bring out the mother/father bear in the affected TL. If a TM in another department is slacking or worse, tell their TL and let them handle it as they see fit. The last thing a new TL needs is to alienate their TL peers and cause drama for the store.


Pretty much agree. Only exception is the Closing Lead, because there may be certain things that need to get done or they may have instructions from other leaders about what they want from their people that night.


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## Rarejem (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, how about I bring up my experience and tenure?
> 
> For example, I could bring up personal experience in feeling unsure and even afraid of approaching certain leaders. I’d want to let the team know that my door is always open and that I genuinely want to help them and take their questions and concerns with no judgement.


My responding question to your experience would be to ask how you overcame this, not how you would be different. Target has an open door policy so it is expected that you would and that the team is already aware that this is the policy. You would not be introducing some new concept here.  (BTW... I have extensive leadership and managerial experience and have interviewed and hired many people.  I had to fire a couple, but typically my hires were good enough that I didn't have to, so I'm not just making this up as I go.)


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## IhateOPmodel (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, how about I bring up my experience and tenure?
> 
> For example, I could bring up personal experience in feeling unsure and even afraid of approaching certain leaders. I’d want to let the team know that my door is always open and that I genuinely want to help them and take their questions and concerns with no judgement.


Target doesn't give a shit about your experience and tenure.  This is evident by them hiring fresh out of college ETLs with zero experience.  They know how long you have been at your store, no need to bring it up.  

Also I wouldn't say the word afraid, say if I had any opportunities it would be challenging my peers. You need to learn how to word your answers and not make yourself sound bad or immature.  Every post I've read of yours, that is the first thing that comes to my mind, immature.


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## Hardlinesmaster (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> Ok, how about I bring up my experience and tenure?
> 
> For example, I could bring up personal experience in feeling unsure and even afraid of approaching certain leaders. I’d want to let the team know that my door is always open and that I genuinely want to help them and take their questions and concerns with no judgement.


Training meter, knowledge, metrics & your reviews. Tenure does not matter at spot.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> The position hasn’t been posted on Workday or the careers site. My HR ETL just had me fill out this worksheet detailing my development plan and then he told me that I just have to wait for my SD to sit down and discuss it with me, whenever that is.


Then you aren’t getting the position.


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## truckdemon (Feb 24, 2022)

As a team lead, I'll be honest with you. If there is an open position and it hasn't been filled yet after a few weeks, its because they already have a plan in place. If they were going to promote you to the spot that is currently avaliable, they've would've already told you. If you aren't currently on the bench, there is a very high chance that you will not get promoted right now. They are creating a developmental plan for you so you can showcase your skill and drive. You will have to pretty much prove to them that you have the full potential so that you can be put on the bench, so when a spot opens up you will already have the tools and will be fully prepared. So don't take it personally when they announce someone else. Be thankful that they are willing to develop you and work hard at it.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

truckdemon said:


> As a team lead, I'll be honest with you. If there is an open position and it hasn't been filled yet after a few weeks, its because they already have a plan in place. If they were going to promote you to the spot that is currently avaliable, they've would've already told you. If you aren't currently on the bench, there is a very high chance that you will not get promoted right now. They are creating a developmental plan for you so you can showcase your skill and drive. You will have to pretty much prove to them that you have the full potential so that you can be put on the bench, so when a spot opens up you will already have the tools and will be fully prepared. So don't take it personally when they announce someone else. Be thankful that they are willing to develop you and work hard at it.


That doesn't make any sense. Our store's GMTL 2 (home, stationery, bath, etc) role was left open for many several months after the last person left the role. She left in January 2021 and it wasn't filled until the following August by a TM at our store who was promoted. We went a whole seven months with just our inbound/GMTL and our GMTL 3 running the floor.


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## truckdemon (Feb 24, 2022)

CartoonPenguin said:


> That doesn't make any sense. Our store's GMTL 2 (home, stationery, bath, etc) role was left open for many several months after the last person left the role. She left in January 2021 and it wasn't filled until the following August by a TM at our store who was promoted. We went a whole seven months with just our inbound/GMTL and our GMTL 3 running the floor.


That's how it's always happened at my store, the position is usually filled or at least an announcement of who will be filling the role after a few weeks. That's strange they'd leave a position open for that long. Well anyways, best of luck to you!


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

truckdemon said:


> That's how it's always happened at my store, the position is usually filled or at least an announcement of who will be filling the role after a few weeks. That's strange they'd leave a position open for that long. Well anyways, best of luck to you!


My store has always seemed to do that. We have two Style/speciality leads, but up until recently, we operated with just one and the second one was just left unfilled until a TM expressed interest.


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## CartoonPenguin (Feb 24, 2022)

truckdemon said:


> As a team lead, I'll be honest with you. If there is an open position and it hasn't been filled yet after a few weeks, its because they already have a plan in place. If they were going to promote you to the spot that is currently avaliable, they've would've already told you. If you aren't currently on the bench, there is a very high chance that you will not get promoted right now. They are creating a developmental plan for you so you can showcase your skill and drive. You will have to pretty much prove to them that you have the full potential so that you can be put on the bench, so when a spot opens up you will already have the tools and will be fully prepared. So don't take it personally when they announce someone else. Be thankful that they are willing to develop you and work hard at it.


Also, I should probably clarify the timeline here. The role itself hasn't been open for a few weeks. My HR ETL had me fill out the development worksheet a few weeks ago, just a few days after the GMTL 3 put in their notice. The leader's last day was on February 11th, meaning that the role hasn't even offically been open for two weeks until tomorrow.


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## Hope4Future (Feb 24, 2022)

lucidtm said:


> Based off of what you said above, the way it would come across to me in the hiring process is someone who would be good at getting the job done, but not someone good at leading a team of people that need guided and, for lack of a better word, babysat. You can't run your department like a dictator and expect positive results. If I were your ETL I wouldn't hire you because I wouldn't want to have to deal with the fallout and stress because of your behavior.





IhateOPmodel said:


> I've learned long ago that the team is more responsive to a leader they like, respect and can relate to than someone who is a hard ass or disciplinarian.  I've had team members who were awful while working under other TL, but once they came and worked for me they were top performers.


This was absolutely the case at my old store. I remember from early 2018 until August of 2019, there was a really friendly ETL-SE who was easy to talk to and morale was high as a result. Unfortunately, he's been replaced twice, and morale has steadily gone down, especially after the most recent ETL-SE was promoted. He had exactly the kind of strict demeanor that you've said you would demonstrate if you became a TL and you will get barebones staff and turnover as people quit.


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## Hal (Feb 24, 2022)

happygoth said:


> I've said it before and I'll say it again: a regular TM, regardless of what kind of power they may think they have, asking questions and trying to lead other TMs is not a good look. You will get push back, you will breed resentment. Unless a leader tells everyone else on the team that this person has the authority, people will be looking at them like "Who the hell are you? Handle your own business."


I'm not saying lead. I'm saying ask questions and go fix things. At no point did I say "go tell people what to do." 

I was a TM and I got promoted. I asked questions. A lot of questions. Because I just wanted to understand people's jobs and I wanted to learn. And if something didn't make sense I asked my leader why we did it that way and can I suggest a change.

Sometimes it worked sometimes it didn't. But as long as you were being respectful and coming from the perspective of legitimately trying to help and understand people were more than happy to vent.


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## SilentCrow (Mar 2, 2022)

The best question asked in this thread was “why should they promote you”.

The response sounded power hungry. The truth of the matter is leadership is walking a grey line. You have people who act like cops trying to reach a parking ticket quota that just write people up all day and berate their team. They tend to wonder why their metrics aren’t moving in a positive direction though. Quite frankly the team don’t like to work for those type of people. So they start do their required responsibilities and going the extra mile isn’t happening. Target you need team members who are engaged in doing more and really want to support you. So the above description I call a “boss”. This is the vibe I got from the response. Not a leader yet so in the OP mind it’s a utopia where everyone is going to respond to backup etc. Reality is you would have other peers and everyone’s workload varies week to week. So the proper way is to strategically plan out how you can support other areas. If a TL has 20 SPLs due that week and just have them and their DBO and you have no workload I don’t expect them to send their team member for backup at all.

The other category is what I call a “leader”. So a response to “why should they promote you” should be more in line with you hope to make an impact on metrics, sales, and guest experience by investing in your team. Additionally, working with your team to identify and start closing gaps in your process to ensure a more efficient work center should be a priority. Most importantly, being an example to others and helping lead team members to hopefully become leaders in the future should be a personal goal. A leaders response should be team focused. Without them and developing them in a positive way you will be nothing.

Now let’s take an example and see how a “boss” reacts to it and how a “leader” would react.

Scenario: Your unload team seem to be taking an excessive amount of time to complete the unload which leads to lingering freight that doesn’t get pushed hindering all store operations.

Boss reaction: Looks at the unload line and pulls any team member he or she feels is moving too slow and documents them.

Result: Frustrated team that hates you and feels attacked.

Leaders reaction: Access the line and wonders is it due to having too many team members on the line or perhaps the custom blocks needs to be rearranged to ensure a steady flow. Proceeds to talk to some of the team members on the line and ask how can he or she make this better for them. Team members mention that if you notice the custom blocks numbers aren’t  going in sequence (ex 1,2,3,4,5) and is jumping a bit causing them to have to look up more and distinguish where to properly put the boxes. Additionally they mention the beginning of the line gets a lot of freight but they’re on the other side of the line and don’t want to all come down to help where they start tripping over each other.

Leader takes this information and works with their ETL to adjust custom blocks and create a more flowing unload line. Now that the leader solved the issue with the process. He or she observes and sees the line and productivity improves. However, there is still a team member or two not moving efficiently. The issues with the line has been solved so that gap has been removed. This now may be a productivity issue. Leader talks with the team member and let’s them know that they seem to be struggling on the line and he or she needs to team member to improve. Offers help to the team member if he or she shall need it and gives some tips. However, reiterates that the team member needs to improve and that this is a PDD hoping that once the leader follows up again the team member productivity improves.

Result: Identified and solved a gap in the process helping the team members with their workload. Properly coached after removing speed bumps with the process.


* Keep in mind the term boss and leader is just my way of separating philosophies. I don’t find the word boss inheritently bad. It’s just how I personally explain the difference in mindsets.


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## SilentCrow (Mar 2, 2022)

Tenure, hard work, nor having an immense amount of knowledge isn’t important. It helps for sure, but leadership is all about mindset.

sorry for the long messages.


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## BackupTL (Mar 2, 2022)

I just wanted to pop in and say meetings are probably the most annoying part of my job because it involves talking about all the things we need to do in a given week, when we could be spending that ~hour in the meeting just doing it. 

You don't wanna be in meetings, lol


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## Far from newbie (Mar 3, 2022)

BackupTL said:


> I just wanted to pop in and say meetings are probably the most annoying part of my job because it involves talking about all the things we need to do in a given week, when we could be spending that ~hour in the meeting just doing it.
> 
> You don't wanna be in meetings, lol


How I feel exactly.  Send an email - get it over with - go DO the work !


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## truckdemon (Mar 4, 2022)

BackupTL said:


> I just wanted to pop in and say meetings are probably the most annoying part of my job because it involves talking about all the things we need to do in a given week, when we could be spending that ~hour in the meeting just doing it.
> 
> You don't wanna be in meetings, lol


I hate the BUS status meetings with a burning passion. At my store we have a paper to fill out and they want it very detailed so I usually spend 30 minutes just doing that. Then we waste an hour of our day in the actual meeting, an hour that I could be using to get the 1937372 tasks I need to get done accomplished. And I talk to my ETL and SD constantly about plans, goals, workload priorities on a day to day basis so then we just sit down and say the same stuff we've been talking about already


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## 60SecondsRemaining (Mar 7, 2022)

A question about TL development.
					

A few weeks ago, I talked with my GM ETL about leadership positions. We chatted and she brough up additonal "developmental activities" around the store to help me as I stay in the pipeline and unofficially train to be a leader. This included being the Seasonal DBO, which is easy so far. Our...




					www.thebreakroom.org
				




I believe I rolled it all together nicely there.

TLDR: Target isn't going to develop you as a leader, doing more work isn't leading.  If you want to be a leader go lead.


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## Hal (Mar 7, 2022)

Idk why we're still responding. 

OP is already proven to be resistant to any advice and will ignore all of this while avoiding any accountability for their actions. They will then in one month will post again complaining that someone got promoted in front of them.


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## Ashfromoldsite (Mar 7, 2022)

Hal said:


> Idk why we're still responding.
> 
> OP is already proven to be resistant to any advice and will ignore all of this while avoiding any accountability for their actions. They will then in one month will post again complaining that someone got promoted in front of them.


Or they have the hots for someone new.


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## Hope4Future (Mar 7, 2022)

I'm not saying that OP hasn't taken the advice being given to them but I can relate to their frustration with feeling like certain team members aren't pulling their weight. There was a GSTL at my old store that almost everyone disliked because she usually hid in her office and only came out to ask guests for surveys.


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## allnew2 (Mar 7, 2022)

Geez what’s happening here. So many complains yet no initiative to fix it by going thru proper channels . Like many posts here it’s all about problem solving and  from what I’ve read on here is all about bitching and more bitching .I’ve had that issue in my store as well in regards to market and p1. The solution was to get together with both etls and sd and come up with a plan , market won’t back up but they will make bales after the receiver is gone . P1 will support with with back up and large item returns until they are off at 12:30. And style will back for 1 hour then p2 will back up for 1 hour and same with opu. Drive up will bag orders and sort returns in spare time.


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